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naraburns  nihil supernum  1yr ago (text post)   34440 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of March 13, 2023

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My problem with the ad campaign is that the money is spent poorly. With that amount you could wrangle Christians together to produce a victim complex lobbying arm that demands one attractive crucifix-wearer in every show and on every board of directors.

Emphasis mine; and in the words of a small green Jedi, "That is why you fail".

@TracingWoodgrains you can accuse me of being "uncharitable" (you may even be correct) but this right here is exactly the sort of thing I'm talking about when I claim that the woke left and the alt right are fruit of the same tree.

Well let’s discuss it.

Many powerful groups in America use a victim narrative to further their interests, in particular Jewish Americans (discussed in the recent “Day of Hate” topic you can find in my reply history). Recently, Asian Americans (the least assaulted group in the nation, the doors for whom were open in a way they would never be in Asia for Americans) have also been winning publicity with claims of extreme assault, and perhaps Oscars with claims of under-representation (they are the most over-represented group). Indigenous groups just a few years ago burned down many Catholic Churches over a largely meritless victimhood-promoting report on the Komloops School burials. There is no group but White Christians who fail to use a victim complex. But this was not always so.

Christians once thrived on a victim narrative. This “saving victim” narrative was once crucial to Christians, who prayed “O Saving Victim lend thine aid, our foes press hard on every side”. Early Christians talked about “being persecuted for righteousness sake”. Jesus says that blessedness (happiness) lies in being persecuted as a Christian which leads to heaven. Jesus pointed the finger at a powerful group as causing this persecution and cursed them; early Christians too were persecuted by Jews and Romans and were venerated as martyrs. The Mass focuses not on the resurrection of Jesus, but on his death and sacrifice.

The Church in its earliest days saw themselves as God’s true victims. When presenting their message to others, they preached the glory and memory of their savior who was willing victimized. And in their rituals, the feeling of pity and love is stirred up by acknowledging the torture of God at the hand of sinners. This is enough to consider a victim narrative natural to Christianity. If a victim narrative is natural to Christianity, then it should be used to benefit Christians.

Many powerful groups in America use a victim narrative to further their interests,

And do you expect me to see this as something good or admirable? If so why? What value does it add? What sort of principles are being maintained?

You say Christians once thrived on a victim narrative, but as @FarNearEverywhere observes, there is a world of Difference between the attitude espoused by the Apostles and the early Church fathers and that embraced by both contemporary Jews and modern-day progressives. I would go so far as to argue that this difference is in fact one of Christianity's core strengths.

Rather than wallowing in self-pity or demanding worldly restitution we are urged to literally "rejoice in our sufferings" because by enduring them and "bearing the cross" as Jesus did, we make ourselves more worthy.

I think the theology of O Salutaris Hostia differs slightly from Help, help, I am being oppressed!

Is this relevant? Is Cafe an alt-righter?

I recognize that the parent comment is probably deserving of a modhat, but at the same time, from one perspective--a rather jaded perspective, mind--Cafe is simply recognizing that furthering a group's power in the modern first world requires getting the management on your side.

Believing that their power needs to be furthered is a pretty good indicator that the person speaking has a perspective utterly alien to Christianity. More generally, a belief that power itself is what determines outcomes is a big part of the commonality we're mutually groping toward.

That's a more fair and direct criticism.

I don't know, but based on their comment history I would argue that they are at least alt-right adjacent.

As for the rest, I feel like this might just be one of those fundamental points upon which we must disagree.

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