This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
I think you are wrong about the purpose of the welfare state. The purpose of the welfare state is to mollify the 15% of people who are happy to barely scrape by if it means that they don't have to work. We pathologise personality issues these days, which means being lazy is a mental disorder.
Here's the thing though - the do-gooders were right, but not for the reason they think - it costs about $40k to keep people imprisoned in the US on average, welfare recipients cost much less and they volunteer for it.
Things can have more than one purpose; social housing decreases demand for unsafe and unsanitary living conditions that shit up the commons for lots of ordinary working people who have to share a street with them and makes do gooders and pinkos feel good about themselves for helping poor unfortunates and mollifies the people who care more about not having to be productive than about their standard of living. Presumably, it also helps some people who are poor through no fault of their own, but no one's ever really cared about them so that's more of a happy side effect than an actual goal.
It's also dramatically cheaper than prison, as you note.
prison is very cheap. Cheaper than a welfare state , as it can be done at scale.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link