site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of February 10, 2025

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

4
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

Now that Trump has ignored the order of a judge to unfreeze the funds he is withholding comes the first constitutional crisis. This is where checks and balances should kick in. If he brazenly defies the courts then Congress can take action against him by impeachment and removal. Hopefully.

  • -24

The Democrats in Congress don't have the votes to impeach him though, so that indeed creates the crisis.

The Republicans in Congress may have the votes to ratify the freeze though. That resolves the issue.

Alternatively there could just be escalating contempt of court proceedings against underlings and disregard for the judiciary.

As a thought experiment, what do you guys think it would take for Republicans in congress to impeach and convict Trump?

Like, suppose all those Reddit comments are right, and Elon really is looting billions of dollars from the treasury for his personal benefit. If Trump turns a blind eye, or even worse, pardons Elon, surely that would be enough right?

At this point I don’t think anything can. If Trump turns a blind eye and pardons Elon, I believe the base will think it’s correct/legal/not a big deal. I don’t even think murder would do it; I think there would be a spin that Trump had to do it.

Actually, now that I think about it, I think if Trump supported the LGBT population, was pro-sex education, or something else very much so not socially conservative, I believe it’d do it. But then he wouldn’t be Trump, so it’s kinda a moot point.

  • -20

Do... do you... you really believe Trump is a doctrinaire social conservative? Like he doesn't support abortion up til birth without apology, I guess that makes him a radical Christian nationalist or whatever the snarl word is now?

Trump's support among social conservatives is that he'll protect us from efforts to make it illegal to be socially conservative, not that he'll enact socially conservative policies. Nobody expected him to be even as socially conservative as he is, we just expected him to make sure the little sisters of the poor get left alone.

Yes? He’s got opposition to abortion, opposition to feminism, support for traditional family values, opposition to pornography, support for abstinence-only sex education, opposition to LGBT rights, support for school prayer, support for school vouchers, support for homeschooling, support for Sunday blue laws, opposition to gambling, and opposition to recreational drug use. Pretty socially conservative to me.

opposition to feminism

Underdefined.

opposition to pornography, support for abstinence-only sex education

Progressives decided to fight on the hill of children's book about leather daddies, but outside of schools he doesn't seem to care. Vance might.

opposition to LGBT rights

He just appointed a married gay Huguenot to the Secretary of the Treasury. Lumping them all together is what generates the confusion, and contributed to the backlash that got Trump reelected.

support for school vouchers, support for homeschooling

Funny how quickly homeschooling went from left-hippy coded to right-coded.

opposition to gambling,

He owned a casino! Politicians are no stranger to hypocrisy but he doesn't seem opposed to gambling. And given the disaster that is sportsbetting, he probably should be.

Can you show me which children’s book about leather daddies you’re talking about?

Grandad's Pride, scroll down to "Reviews with pictures" if you're curious. Or here's an article with a description:

Will Taylor described two particular images in the book: ‘We identified two images of men who are partially naked in leather bondage gear. One has a leather cod-piece moulded tightly around his crotch along with garters running down his thighs. He also has a studded dog collar around his neck and knee-high boots. Both have various leather straps around their bodies and studs/spikes.’

I'm pretty live and let live and not exactly put-off by collars and garters, where appropriate. But I'm baffled by the fact anyone thought this book was a good idea, and anyone that green-lit it should be on a watchlist. I wouldn't complain about- what was it, penguins with two dads that was popular for a while? The line between encouraging acceptance and being porn-brained creep is not thin; there's a great big flashing wall between those, and yet here we are.

If you want to say conservatives abused the "groomer" thing, I'll agree. Unfortunately, there's just enough wackadoos that pull this shit and useful idiots that defend it to provide a good supply of ammunition.

More comments

Trump opposes early term abortion bans while supporting late term abortion bans, and it’s difficult to tell where the line is for him. This gives him a position quite similar to the median voter. He’s pro gay marriage but anti-transgenderism, opposes porn in school libraries but doesn’t seem to have a problem with it more generally. I don’t know where you’re getting the idea that he supports blue laws or has a particular position on gambling.

Trump is more or less a median voter on social issues who strongly supports issues which benefit his socially conservative base(like school choice and homeschooling- neither of which are particularly unpopular among the general public).