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Notes -
He meant that, if you have 1 heterosexual and 2 bisexuals of the opposite sex, everyone can still sleep with everyone else. If there's nobody else of the same sex being heterosexual doesn't affect the number of combinations.
I think this works with one straight man and two bisexual women, but might not work with the average straight women and two gay men. I think jealousy is much more likely if your partner is having other sex to which, by definition, you're not invited - sex the very thought of which might enrage you. If you're all bisexuals, and your other two partners are doing nothing together that they haven't also done with you in the mix - who's counting? But a straight woman with no interest in watching Boyfriend One sodomize Boyfriend Two might get upset if they're spending too much time together instead of on her.
I mean, straight women fucking love seeing hot men railing each other, so this doesn’t seem like that much of a problem to me.
Do they? Last time I saw data on this I thought it said straight women didn't really consume gay porn.
My understanding — I think from an old pornhub survey? — is that women consume much more gay porn than men do, and also more lesbian porn as well. So gay men probably still consume more gay porn that straight women per capita, but there’s still a large female straight contingent. And this is in a medium where it’s inherently unfavourable to female titillation; the porn vs erotica thing remains salient.
I’m not convinced that women self-insert as the uke when looking at gay porn or BL, this doesn’t match my experience talking to fujos at all.
It might be true that women like two men getting hot and steamy with each other, but purely as an observer.
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Fujoshi is an example but I rather doubt that it applies to Western hardcore stuff. The manga usually isn't (very) explicit; it's more about observing the emotional reactions you would want between two people you also find attractive, rather than self-inserting as the female in the fiction.
My understanding is that (until quite recently, maybe?) most straight women find bi guys a turnoff, so I wouldn't think they'd want to watch gay men either.
This gets complicated:
There is data out there, but it's pretty much trash quality. PornHub Insights (cw: no explicit images, but still a pornhub link) has some numbers, but they're filled with selection effect (who uses PH) after selection effect (who uses PH in non-incognito mode while pegging as a woman to google analytics?).
But there's clearly a sizable raw number, given the existence (and indeed prevalance) of fem-gaze-focused M/M in fandom and especially fanfiction spaces.
But a lot of women like the idea of gay or bi men, but don't actually want a bi guy in a relationship, either. I have absolutely met fujoshi that get the ick from guys who bottom, there's absolutely an expectation that bisexuals will be driven to cheat or are secretly gay and looking for a beard, concerns about disease or not-condoned infidelity, so on.
But that doesn't prevent them from liking it as an idea, or a comic, or whatever, and there's indeed a pretty wide variety of artists and especially writers that focus on that demographic.
And there are people for whom it's clearly a pretty strong kink.
Straight women get the ick from guys who enjoy the female/submissive role in a relationship and only enjoy romance fiction because they're self-inserting as the bottom (M/F or M/M, doesn't matter)? What a complete surprise, say it ain't so.
I would expect the 'bisexuals will be driven to cheat, etc.' concerns apply to both top and bottom, though for slightly different reasons for each (and believe it'd be a more salient concern with the bottoms simply due to how human instinct works)- for instance, tops driven to cheat more just because they're tops and have twice the opportunity.
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Oof, how could I forget! I would think slash fiction is much bigger in the West.
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Can you dig it out? I can think of several ways both of you can be right.
I think one of the kernels was that women are surprising consumers of lesbian and solo female porn for similar reasons that men are surprising consumers of big dick porn. Focus on aspirational anatomy and the pleasure of the specific genitals the viewer has.
Gay porn is often also produced with an aim towards the (gay) male gaze - women like gay male romance novels and such (at least Japanese ones do) but it is quite different to actually viewing the railing as it where.
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I don't see how bisexuality changes that. If you're a woman with two bisexual boyfriends, how does being interested in other women affect whether you're "by definition not invited" to M/M sex? Without adding a girlfriend you're not having sex with women either way. Bisexuality isn't required for a woman to be interested in two men having sex, as seen by (for instance) the market for yaoi.
You misunderstand- yaoi isn't quite a match for yuri since most of the appeal (and remember, that's why it's called yaoi) comes from self-inserting as the bottom [edit: this isn't entirely what happens, but I think it's a useful first-approximation in this case].
So the attraction from an otherwise-straight woman seeing two dudes having sex would generally be that self-insertion. If her husband is the bottom, he's assuming her role, and women don't tend to like that very much -> "feels like you're not invited".
If that was another woman instead the dynamic is instantly and instinctively different, since she by definition isn't going to be topping the man and the "invitation" comes in the form of "watch his attractive might and dominance without being replaced". The distaff/mirror counterpart would be if a woman brings a boy home (as in: young/inexperienced enough to dominate [and not replace the man's role in the relationship], cute enough not to be aesthetically repellent), but the average age of such a participant quickly creates practical problems [it ain't the '70s no more].
Two women doing it, from the male perspective, extend the "invitation" by "come and watch the show" (and the other woman gets some variety out of it that the man himself cannot provide- women are generally more aesthetically pleasing than men are when naked), which is why MFF/MmF threesomes are inherently stable if all the participants are nominally straight, but MMF/MfF threesomes are not (the latter inherently replacing the woman's submissive role).
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