This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
Sure that's all true but the progressive ideas are really dumb and don't work.
In Britain or Australia or the EU (or California in the US) sensible moderate, well-educated, expert-informed policies are implemented consistently with full cooperation from the bureaucracy and NGOs... and they don't work. They don't deliver safety or per-capita economic growth or technology or military power, they retard development and consequently retard political stability. Papering over the cracks by weaponizing the legal system or using migration to drown out electoral opposition doesn't address the underlying issue, it won't make the system actually performant. Can't blame Russian bots, disinformation, social media for their own incompetence forever.
All the AI/tech wealth in California can't enable them to build a mildly modern rail network. The money goes to lawyers, environmental groups... Britain pays to give land to Mauritius. Maybe the lawyers are getting kickbacks.
All this diversity is extremely expensive! The Danish and Dutch analyses prove it in pure tax terms, before even bringing in crime and terrorism. It's a cost without benefit, save electoral impacts. The Quality Learing Centre is not a good long-term investment.
No matter how many rain dances the tribesmen do it won't do anything to actually bring rain. No matter how much DEI is done (and they do a hell of a lot of DEI in South Africa) they can't actually achieve equality or equity. Partly that's because it's about making sinecures but partly it's because the very structural assumptions and ideas are wrong.
So it's true that against the power of the assembled institutions and elite groupthink and acculturation, the right is outmatched. It is easier to bring people in than get rid of them in the present system. The left can afford to make more errors than the right and still advance their agenda. The left can do lots and lots of wrecking and squander countless trillions.
But how long can the assembled institutions last when they're up against the underlying nature of reality?
It's one of the most important questions. How much can the government donkey be loaded with useless DEI eaters before it buckles?
Now that the Dems are gently kicking out the zionists, which I understand are the competent lot, who will be in charge? A bunch of drunk white women? Third-world oligarchs in exile?
What happens when the government-run grocery stores fail to deliver the expected relief in NYC?
Is the US government just going bankrupt after infinite gibs? What happens then, the Chinese come in to repossess?
More options
Context Copy link
The Soviet Union lasted 70 years. There is a great deal of ruin in a nation. The marketplace of ideas can stay irrational longer than you can stay alive.
Well put.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link