This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
I really don't like making grand pronouncements (I think it's a bit narcissistic) but since I seem to have a reputation on The Motte I think it's only fair to take my licks:
Blah blah blah, words words words, excuses excuses, feel free to get your licks in now.
This is an area where number lawyering distorts what's rather straight forward observationally. Cost of living is bad, and constantly getting worse. That it was getting worse at a faster rate eariler, when it wasn't as bad on absolute terms, isn't really a headscratcher.
You're comparing rate of inflation, but sentiment is accounted for by looking at cumulative effect. Inflation is a rate of change number. Inflation was bad under Biden, it ate away a lot of slack in the system; now under Trump inflation is still too high even if it's eating cost of living at a lower rate of increase.
Now this is a different conversation than laying blame, but it helps udnerstand why comparing raw inflation rate is not as straightforward when translating it into felt effects.
Imagine you're speeding toward a cliff and accelerating. Now we swap drivers, and not only does that driver maintain the speed, but he continues accelerating! only not accelerating as quickly as driver 1.
Does it really make sense to be confused that the second driver is met with more panic than the first?
Inflation only goes one way. We're not getting deflation without a recession.
I hope there aren't too many people under the delusion that 2019 prices can come back
I don't think people care too much about the technical definition of a recession. For a lot of segments of the economy outside of healthcare and AI spend, we're already there.
This election, as well as 2024, has shown that the people are very much in favor of deflation and will punish those in power severely if they do not get it.
Actual deflation (as opposed to slower inflation) would be a disaster. I have no doubt people think they want it, but they would be pissed if they saw what happened as a result. Even if they couldn't make the connection, they would still want to punish those in power for the shitty economy that ensued.
Maybe. It depends on how it hits. Secular deflation in the technology sector was universally loved, food prices and fuel prices being low are also considered a good thing (especially since fuel prices are an input to everything in the economy). Stock market deflation people by in large don't care about because only half of people in America hold stocks at all (including through retirement accounts).
There's a good portion of (generally younger) people who are pining for a housing market crash as affordability there has gotten really bad and most Americans would like to see healthcare costs drop sharply.
Maybe there are some areas where deflation would be really bad, but for at least essentials, the cost of these things is suffocating to most Americans.
This sentiment and punishment is a reaction to a shitty economy (edit: for those not on the top side of the K).
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link