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PaperclipPerfector  10mo ago (text post)   31451 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of July 10, 2023

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I’m a teacher in Canada, where salaries often top out around 105k CAD. Teachers here are also distressingly low-g, low curiosity, low nuance. Realistic raises aren’t going to fix it.

Raises combined with aptitude testing ought to do it, since then you get applicants who are both talented enough to be a good teacher/work elsewhere productively and are at least somewhat interested in teaching.

I don't know much about Canada, but in Los Angeles, a teacher starts at 56K and can reach 98K with a doctorate and 14 years of experience. Meanwhile, the median starting salary for an attorney in Los Angeles is $121,000.

Realistic raises aren’t going to fix it.

I didn't say anything about "realistic" raises. I referred to necessary raises.

ADA earn less.

https://www.biglawinvestor.com/district-attorney-salary/

Yes, everyone knows that some get paid less. That is why I referred to median salaries.

But, for the record, the salary range for a District Attorney III in Los Angeles County is 118,000 - 163,000 per year. Moreover, of the 1000 people listed here with the job title of district attorney, it looks like 700 made base pay of 125k plus, 600 made 150k plus, and 300 made 190k plus.

Lawyers don't get summers off, don't get a pension and spend 3 extra years in school. Also the lawyer number is skewed upwards by big law that recruits from T14 schools and where you work insane hours, most people don't get that and will start closer $70k.

I knew someone would miss the point. The point is NOT that it is unfair that lawyers make more than teachers. The point is that, if we want to get smart people to go into teaching as a career, such as by retaining the Teach For America people I referred to, then we have to compensate them a lot better.

Lawyers . . . spend 3 extra years in school.

No, two extra years, because a teaching credential usually takes a year. And if you look at the salary schedule in the link, a teacher with 2 years of experience is making under 57K in Los Angeles. And, of course, many law students have summer clerkships which now have a median salary of more than $3000/wk for 10 weeks.

Also the lawyer number is skewed upwards by big law that recruits from T14 schools and where you work insane hours

No, I cited the median salary, which unlike the mean, is not skewed by big law salaries.

Trying to get better teachers by increasing salaries is trying to push on a rope. You won't get better teachers; you'll get the same teachers with more money. You need to increase the standards first, and if and when you note that you're actually facing a shortage that is credibly due to compensation, only then increase salaries.

No, giving raises to current teachers will not improve teaching (Though my best HS math teacher, Mr. Gou5dge (the 5 was silent) left teaching for better pay in law). But increasing salaries for new teachers will. Eg, more of those TFA teachers I mentioned will stick with teaching,and more smart grads will opt for teaching instead of other careers.

No, it won't, not unless you increase the standards first. You'll get more people in the field for the money, but most of them won't be the right people -- they'll be those attracted to the field for the low standards and high pay.

You also could get higher quality people who went into other fields for the higher salaries.

Again, you seem to be ignoring the Teach for America examples.

Besides, I am not saying that increasing salaries is sufficient for improvement, but rather that it is necessary. After all, if you increase standards first, you will have a shortage of qualified applicants unless you also increase salaries.

And, again. I am addressing OP's complaint about dumb teachers. If smart people have lucrative options like law and medicine, few are going to go into teaching, regardless of whether standards are high, low, or in the middle.

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