naraburns nihil supernum
6mo ago
(text post)
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Israel-Gaza Megathread #2
This is a refreshed megathread for any posts on the conflict between (so far, and so far as I know) Hamas and the Israeli government, as well as related geopolitics. Culture War thread rules apply.
That the IDF released audio of Hamas operatives saying it was from Islamic Jihad, but the audio is clearly faked with bad Palestinian accents and crappy acting. Why do you think the IDF would release obviously doctored audio? Stupidity thinking that no one would call them on it? Rationally making the calculation their supporters would eat it up and it won't make their detractors any angrier than they are? That maybe it isn't actually faked and some Hamas operatives actually do just talk like that? But even to me, I don't speak a lick of Arabic, the tone of voices does sound like script reading and it felt very convenient how they described so much incriminating and explanatory information in a minute of conversation, like exposition from the beginning of a bad movie. Thoughts?
TBH, what is the difference? If Israel blew up a hospital, it probably contained Hamas operatives and weapons (there are none in Gaza known to lack such things, ditto schools, retirement homes, and all other potentially sympathetic targets). Lets say IDF missile launch operator #112 misread an intelligence report that said a mass barrage was about to be launched from the roof of Mecca Hospital in Gaza, and instead leveled Medina Hospital. What would change? there would still be operatives and a weapons cache there in most cases. In the incredibly unlikely scenario that there was not, fog of war is fog of war. Is Israel not allowed to make a mistake when targeting rocket launch sites? Police forces in the 1st world are certainly not held to such a standard in active shooter or hostage scenarios (both of which are easy to deal with compared to the current situation in Gaza). If a hostage in a bank heist is wearing a Nixon mask and charges a police officer the PO is not put on trial for shooting said Nixon masker.
All that said, its probably not Israel, because they know they are held to a standard that is higher than almost any other country in history. Most would have ethnically cleansed the West Bank and genocided Gaza by now. Israel might be the only country in history to show such restraint.
The difference would be if Israel launched a surprise attack on a hospital that killed 500 innocents without giving them warning to evacuate. That did not actually happen apparently, but if it did it would be bad.
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Notes -
In regards to the recent hospital explosion, it's looking increasingly likely that Israel did not cause the explosion.
https://manifold.markets/MilfordHammerschmidt/did-the-idf-just-now-blow-up-a-hosp
I saw this however on Twitter:
https://twitter.com/alextomo/status/1714670858914894046?t=UcPxGEUM5ShnUpc8Hav3Vw&s=19
https://twitter.com/IDF/status/1714548529538953637?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1714548529538953637%7Ctwgr%5E4bbaa419eb9133e336435eb810800500af090537%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.hindustantimes.com%2Fworld-news%2Fidf-shares-audio-of-hamas-allegedly-talking-about-rocket-that-hit-gaza-hospital-it-misfired-101697630817752.html
That the IDF released audio of Hamas operatives saying it was from Islamic Jihad, but the audio is clearly faked with bad Palestinian accents and crappy acting. Why do you think the IDF would release obviously doctored audio? Stupidity thinking that no one would call them on it? Rationally making the calculation their supporters would eat it up and it won't make their detractors any angrier than they are? That maybe it isn't actually faked and some Hamas operatives actually do just talk like that? But even to me, I don't speak a lick of Arabic, the tone of voices does sound like script reading and it felt very convenient how they described so much incriminating and explanatory information in a minute of conversation, like exposition from the beginning of a bad movie. Thoughts?
TBH, what is the difference? If Israel blew up a hospital, it probably contained Hamas operatives and weapons (there are none in Gaza known to lack such things, ditto schools, retirement homes, and all other potentially sympathetic targets). Lets say IDF missile launch operator #112 misread an intelligence report that said a mass barrage was about to be launched from the roof of Mecca Hospital in Gaza, and instead leveled Medina Hospital. What would change? there would still be operatives and a weapons cache there in most cases. In the incredibly unlikely scenario that there was not, fog of war is fog of war. Is Israel not allowed to make a mistake when targeting rocket launch sites? Police forces in the 1st world are certainly not held to such a standard in active shooter or hostage scenarios (both of which are easy to deal with compared to the current situation in Gaza). If a hostage in a bank heist is wearing a Nixon mask and charges a police officer the PO is not put on trial for shooting said Nixon masker.
All that said, its probably not Israel, because they know they are held to a standard that is higher than almost any other country in history. Most would have ethnically cleansed the West Bank and genocided Gaza by now. Israel might be the only country in history to show such restraint.
The difference would be if Israel launched a surprise attack on a hospital that killed 500 innocents without giving them warning to evacuate. That did not actually happen apparently, but if it did it would be bad.
If the hospital was also the site of a military installment (they all are), why would that be bad?
Because an unnecessary number of civilians would be killed.
If the hospital is the site of a military installment, the number is not unnecessary, just excessive.
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