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PaperclipPerfector  3mo ago (text post)   25822 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of January 15, 2024

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https://apnews.com/article/ron-desantis-250c8ed4b49843350e258f0c2754c8ba

Ron Desantis has dropped out of the republican presidential primary and endorsed Trump.

Now, obviously, this will not change the end result- Trump will win the primary and obtain the republican nomination. But, there is a dim chance that it takes Haley into the #1 spot in New Hampshire, embarrassing for Trump, by consolidating the anti-Trump vote. Granted this is an increase from like 5% to 10%, but it's more likely to give Nikki Haley a boost before a do-or-die primary for her. It's I guess dimly possible that there's a few voters undecided between Desantis and Haley who will now support Trump, but I have to think this isn't a very big group.

Ron Desantis will likely try to find a Trump cabinet position; but it seems likely that he won't get one. Trump's broadsides against Desantis have lasted long enough to think they might be genuine. I would expect Desantis to finish his term and then look into either a senate seat, or a run in 2028.

I notice I am confused. There is a 10-15% chance that the Supreme Court rules Trump ineligible for the presidency. There is an additional 10-15% chance that Trump is literally in jail by the time the convention rolls around. Just because DeSantis can't beat Trump in a primary doesn't mean he has no chance. Even if he doesn't have the money for an active campaign, endorsing Trump kills his momentum for a "told you so" convention chaos campaign.

Is that where the prediction markets are? I think the SCOTUS probability is overestimated.

This market has been pretty consistent at 80-90% that the Colorado decision is reversed. I think people tend to underestimate the likelihood of an affirmation for a couple of reasons:

  1. Supreme Court justices are electorally insulated from the excesses of Trumpism.

  2. Conservative Supreme Court justices are uniquely predisposed to be unsympathetic towards mobs of people storming government buildings to protest official processes they disagree with.

Unfortunately the Supreme Court isn't the end of it unless they rule categorically that Trump is and will remain eligible, which seems unlikely. The only real way to do that is are the related, very dodgy "The Presidency isn't an office under the constitution" and "The Presidential oath isn't an oath to support the constitution" arguments. Roberts might like those, but I don't know about the others. If they claim the standard of law used was wrong, the Colorado Supreme Court on remand can just claim that even under the Supreme Court's given standard of law, Trump is out (They can do this whether or not it plainly makes sense or not, as with the various gun control cases following Bruen). Even if SCOTUS demands an actual conviction, Jack Smith can just whip up a DC jury and get one.

There is a strict "did Trump commit insurrection (or aid/comfort enemies) as defined by 14th Amendment" option. It has some benefit in the sense that the dicta could cordone off efforts to disqualify people other than Trump, although I expect it's even less appealing to Roberts and a good few other people on the conservative side of the bench, especially with how mushy it'd have to go between factual analysis and legal analysis.

That said, I think you're being insufficiently paranoid. There's a lot of problems with any result that doesn't either clearly disqualify him, or clearly mark attempts to disqualify as violating a clearly established statutory or constitutional right, that are far bigger than Trump or the 2024 elections.

There is a strict "did Trump commit insurrection (or aid/comfort enemies) as defined by 14th Amendment" option.

The Supreme Court in its role as an appeals court would not decide this question; it's a question for a trial court. As an appeals court it can only say that the legal theory the court used to decide Trump committed insurrection is wrong, or that factual findings it made were baseless or wrongly admitted (e.g. admitting January 6 hearing testimony). And even the trial court can only look at the case put before it; nothing the Colorado courts do precludes a Federal trial for insurrection in DC. So the only way the Court can actually settle the issue is by declaring that as a matter of law, Trump cannot be disqualified full stop.

That said, I think you're being insufficiently paranoid. There's a lot of problems with any result that doesn't either clearly disqualify him, or clearly mark attempts to disqualify as violating a clearly established statutory or constitutional right, that are far bigger than Trump or the 2024 elections.

Those problems are unavoidable no matter what the result. Anything that clearly disqualifies him marks the whole Federal election system as clearly illegitimate to maybe 30% of the population, maybe a bit more. Anything that does not marks the Supreme Court as clearly illegitimate to maybe 40% of the population (a 40% including most of the elites and those in government), maybe a bit more. Anything that leaves it muddy will have to be resolved one way or another by the election, unless Trump dies.

The Supreme Court in its role as an appeals court would not decide this question; it's a question for a trial court. As an appeals court it can only say that the legal theory the court used to decide Trump committed insurrection is wrong, or that factual findings it made were baseless or wrongly admitted (e.g. admitting January 6 hearing testimony).

While extraordinarily unlikely, it's at least procedurally possible for SCOTUS to provide dicta far broader than a ruling itself, such as defining Section 3 insurrection specifically or requiring specific types and grades of behavior that isn't present here. People can (and probably will!) still defy that! cfe my Bruen rants. But it's an option that makes those things defiance.

And even the trial court can only look at the case put before it; nothing the Colorado courts do precludes a Federal trial for insurrection in DC.

That's fairer, and while the timeline for an insurrection trial is wildly implausible, there's nothing preventing people from taking some other federal conviction and (even implausibly) reading it as a Section 3-disqualifying behavior.

Anything that leaves it muddy will have to be resolved one way or another by the election, unless Trump dies.

I wish I was that optimistic: this weapon doesn't get put away just because the highest-profile target disappears, and it doesn't stop on November 6th or even January of next year.

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