This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
Culture war going hot: https://www.cnn.com/2024/12/04/us/brian-thompson-united-healthcare-death/index.html
A gunman has killed the CEO of United Healthcare this morning, and has disappeared into the city. I’m somewhat surprised this isn’t more common, especially given the nature of healthcare company’s profit motives. I could imagine “we denied your wife’s medical claim and are sorry for her death. Also your bill is past due and we are sending you to collections. Thank you understanding.” might be a story that exists in a lot of people.
Expect to see more private security, more private flights, more underground parking and armored cars and so forth for a while.
This was clearly an assassination.
The killer left behind bullet casings, which was at first viewed as “oh, this was an amateur – what kind of professional doesn’t police their brass?” even with the suppressor on the gun. Then it was revealed the three bullet casings each contained a different word: one said deny, one said defend, one said depose. Some speculated it was related to a book titled “Delay, Deny, Defend” about the evils of insurance companies, although the title doesn’t quite add up.
Other speculate the word “Depose” has to do with the recent DOJ probe into Brian Thompson for insider trading.
I was stunned watching many on social media celebrated the murder like they were celebrating the death of a terrorist. UHC is the largest provider of Medicare advantage in the country. We need better insurance, absolutely - but insurance is the only reason many can even afford basic care in the first place. UHC isn't even one of the insurance companies that yesterday decided to stop covering anesthesia in the middle of surgeries if the surgeries took too long (although UHC has the highest percentage of denied claims, in part because of their share of the Medicare advantage market).
If people don't like denials of coverage now, I think they'd hate rationed healthcare under a "Medicare 4 All" system even more; the government-run V.A. shows exactly how bad we are at those kinds of systems. Some coverage and cheaper procedures is better than wait times or tribunal refusals due to resource shortages or determined societal need.
Although I can't expect the people celebrating his death to understand that. Most Americans have a loose grasp, at best, of how health insurance works; I had recently seen an Xcretement with the following sentiment:
Which is... bafflingly incorrect. Insurance covering a surgery doesn't suddenly make that surgery legal in whatever state? It's just... not how any of this works, although I don't know why I expected a Starbucks unionization attempt to know any better.
Does the United States have it in us to engage in vigilantism? Will all CEOs, billionaires, etc., start to show up on the chopping block? Is "eating the rich" leaving electoral politics behind and instead taking matters into their own "hands?" Will this change the gun control debate at all? How dystopian are we about to get? Or, like everything else, is this tapping the sign of "nothing ever happens?"
I believe it's the latter; this will get forgotten about quickly. Billionaires et. al. can afford private security, but there's been a recent movement attacking small business owners as the "petit bourgeois," who are less likely to be able to afford that kind of stuff. Those grievances are likely more local, though, and less likely to make the news. Local level "activism" doesn't generate attention, so maybe it's less of a concern. Idk. I don't think Americans have it in us to truly seek a revolution. Even the "Insurrection" would have continued the status quo of the government system, just with a different person at the top.
I would think that "depose" was reference to the common meaning of the term: "to remove from a throne or other high position". Thus "Delay, Deny, Defend" is followed up with "Deny, Defend.... Depose". Sort of a "sic semper tyrannis" for the modern age.
It's also very possible there was a fourth bullet in the gun labeled "Delay" that jammed or otherwise wasn't fired.
Or maybe omission of it was meant as a message of no longer delaying the "depose" part.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link