site banner
PaperclipPerfector  5d ago (text post)   2302 thread views

Small-Scale Question Sunday for May 25, 2025

Do you have a dumb question that you're kind of embarrassed to ask in the main thread? Is there something you're just not sure about?

This is your opportunity to ask questions. No question too simple or too silly.

Culture war topics are accepted, and proposals for a better intro post are appreciated.

2
Top Bottom Old Controversial Comments
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

Oh man, this guy gets to read the second half of Cryptonomicon for the first time.

I'm always in torture arguing with myself about whether it's too soon to read it (yet) again. I think it's been every 3-4 years.

Right?! I kinda feel like in retrospect, Cryptonomicon and the Baroque cycle were peak Stephenson, and were it not for the whole LitRPG phenomenon, I'd probably be doing more re-reads of my favorite works of his. Hell, if it weren't for Fall, I'd probably still be gobbling up whatever he chose to write!

While we're at it I'll bother you for some litrpg recs. Been toying with writing one and want more inspo.

Dungeon Crawler Carl was my gateway drug to LitRPG and it's must-read series in my book. Others that I have highly enjoyed include 12 Miles Below, Noobtown, He Who Fights Monsters, The Menocht Loop, The Dungeon Slayer, and Oh, Great, I Was Reincarnated as a Farmer. Some of these aren't, strictly speaking, LitRPG in the sense that they talk about and/or expose game mechanics in any sense, but they're all good. There are a couple more series that I left out that I don't think were categorized as LitRPG and there are a few more series that I've read but didn't continue for various reasons, a big one unfortunately being genre fatigue.

Wow, haven't read a single one of those or even heard of most. DCC is definitely a big name but several people have independently warned me against it as apparently the author is prone to long, smug /r/atheism style rants which I've had more than enough of elsewhere. Will look into the others though. Lots of time for audiobooks on the road so I tend to rotate among history, age of sail fiction (currently enjoying the Master and Commander series), business nonfiction, and litrpg.

So let's see, my main recs would have to be:

  • Worth the Candle: Probably no introduction needed. Perhaps the best litrpg ever and a masterful treatment of the genre.
  • Bog Standard Isekai: Fantastic but still early in writing with lots more to come. Wouldn't have started if I'd known it was unfinished, but glad I did.
  • Cradle if it counts. Also needs no introduction. Audiobooks are good.
  • The Elder Lands: Rating this so highly because while it's not amazingly-written it's pretty good and very much to my taste; especially the setting which is fairly gritty low-magic base-building with realistic politics, but only two books are out currently. Excited to see where it goes.

Honorable mentions:

  • Primal Hunter: Pretty good writing, worldbuilding, and characters. Not finished but there's a ton already written including 12 audiobooks out. Somehow I find the audiobooks way more entertaining than reading the text, which is unusual for me.
  • Mother of Learning: Absolutely adore it, but not sure if it counts as the genre.

Ones I sorta enjoyed but wouldn't necessarily recommend:

  • Awaken Online: Just generally falls short of what it could be. Often left wondering why the characters don't do the obvious thing.
  • I'm Not the Hero: Passable in every sense.
  • Isekai Magus: At least the first three(?) books. These aren't great and the constant horny harem stuff gets a bit tiresome (mainly because the MC's ethics about it make zero sense and also because he has bad taste in partners IMO) but when the main storyline is fun it's a lot of fun. The first three books (I think) form a fairly complete arc with the MC going from lost wanderer to building himself a small kingdom and struggling to defend it against vast forces. All well and good. Then I guess the author ran out of ideas and transports MC to a new world to basically start over, abandoning almost all progress and characters. Totally lost interest.

Just not good:

  • Ultimate Level 1: Low-quality in many ways but has some fun moments. This one got some extra points from me because the MC uses a spear, which I like, but I didn't even finish the second book.
  • Legend of the Arch Magus: Interesting premise and sometimes worldbuilding but it's not handled well. Fun if you're in the mood for a perpetually OP MC stomping people who underestimate him. Finished two books and lost interest.
  • Arcane Ascension: Just not great but I didn't even finish the first book so who knows.

Did I warn you that I'm totally a cheap date when it comes to Kindle books in general and LitRPG in particular since it plugs right into the brain centers that began to develop the first time I picked up D&D as a wee lad? Because I'm totally a cheap date when it comes to Kindle books in general and LitRPG in particular! That disclaimer out of the way, while I can't remember anything specifically atheistic in DCC, it's more than crapsack (grimdark?) enough of a setting to invoke that sort of thing and Carl is definitely guilty of wangst-filled thought monologues throughout the series; I honestly wouldn't be surprised if one or more of those was explicitly atheistic and it just didn't register highly enough for me to remember it. Anyway, I should probably qualify the series that I've enjoyed so let me do that real quick, starting with the fact that out of all of them, 12 Miles Below is the only one that doesn't have any sort of comparative rules or system and that in fact intriguing enemies and RPG systems are definitely one of the hooks that get me into series. So:

  • 12 Miles Below: I utterly adore the world and the worldbuilding of this series. Good writing and characters as well! I'll devour these as soon as they appear.
  • Noobtown: Intricate RPG system, lots of "fish out of water" humor along with hysterical foil characters, lots of pop culture referencing, not too heavy of a tone in general with periodic exceptions for reasons of Plot.
  • He Who Fights Monsters: Another intricate RPG system, tons of fights, many of them epic, surprising world, character and system depth overall, which isn't surprising given that the series is long and still unfinished. That said, the MC is a self-described chuunibyou and he's got a lot of that wangst going on, so maybe get some other opinions if those things don't sound like your cup of tea.
  • The Menocht Loop: I don't even remember how this one came across my radar but I utterly adore the magic system and the worldbuilding of these books. This series starts with the MC being way OP for his world but explores what that looks like in a larger 'verse. This is perhaps the best written series of all of the ones that I mentioned, with a well-thought-out magic system, and a rich 'verse for the characters to explore. Exceptionally well written characters, at that.
  • The Dungeon Slayer: Just good overall, but an interesting system where most characters are locked into their overall level and skillset, with the exception of the MC who starts with nothing but can actually advance. Some interesting characters and bosses and good fighting as well.
  • Oh, Great, I was Reincarnated as a Farmer: This one's another humorous, "fish out of water," series, that's all about the MC gaming the System to advance and prosper despite the lowly farmer class he inherits when he enters the world. Not outstanding, but the humor largely worked for me and did I mention that I'm a cheap date to begin with?

And thanks for the recommendations! I haven't read any of your main recommendations yet, though it sounds like I'll have to check out all of them at some point. I actually have Primal Hunter in my Kindle library, but I know I haven't read it yet. In fact, I have several LitRPG books and even series in my library that I haven't gotten around to because some shiny daily or countdown deal caught my fancy as I have a bad habit of reading the free sapble and then buying if I like what I've read, sometimes multiple books in the series. Looking at you, Guardian of Aster Fall series. Don't think I've forgotten you either, Cyber Dreams. And that's just LitRPG in particular, I have plenty of sci-fi, fantasy, nonfiction, and psych stuff in my library to read (someday?) as well, so I'm definitely on your wavelength there. And doggone it, I only ever did read the first few books of the Master and Commander series... But yeah, I'll have to check out your must-reads and honorable mentions for sure!

You're read Worth the Candle already?

Definitely. Will again in another year or two I bet.

The Diamond Age is definitely my favorite but yes Cryptonomicon and Baroque Cycle are superb. Also if you like that era of Stevenson you might check out Interface which he co-wrote. Anathem felt a bit conceited but was worth one read.

Personally I find the trope of the hyperintelligent, hyper-competent black woman that everyone underestimates because she's black (and a woman) grating, so the next couple things I read of his (like Reamde) put me off. Sadly it felt like his mind going a bit. Sure, of course a random adopted Eritrean (average IQ 68) is going to be a brilliant hacker and international operative. Got a problem with that, chud? It's exactly the reverse of the verisimilitude which normally makes his works so wonderful.

Haven't tried Fall or DODO yet and I'm a bit reluctant. Seveneves could be great but I haven't gotten around to it.

Recently finished the Baroque Cycle after stopping at the second book for ten years. It's a straight-up masterpiece.

Wow, The Diamond Age is my single favorite work of his as well! Given your dislike for those aspects of Reamde, I'd definitely tell you to stay away from Fall--it takes that reverse verisimilitude and cranks it up to 11, so much so that my favorite review of it described it as fractally bad. I would add that Fall is a dreadfully predictable wall-banger of a novel that's about as subtle as a brick to the head. Worse, it wears Neal Stephenson's style as a skin suit. Seveneves isn't that bad, IMO, if you can stand an expy of Neal DeGrasse Tyson being a character and played straight as a hyperintelligent protagonist, though there are other parts you might not enjoy as well.

So at this point I can't even read The Diamond Age any more in the sense that I'm so familiar with it that it fails to cohere into a narrative. It is now a text. I can recite long passages fairly accurately from memory and have a copy on my desktop because I tend to quote it a lot. When I try to read it it's just "this passage, then this passage, then this passage..."

All of this is a by-product of having read it so many times; didn't get this way on purpose.

By the way if you haven't listened to the audiobook narrated by Jennifer Wiltsie I'd strongly recommend doing so. Somehow hearing her read it called my attention to all sorts of details I hadn't really absorbed before. It felt like it somehow restored about 20% of the feeling of reading it for the first time. Plus I just think she's a perfect narrator for it. Actually listened to another audiobook narrated by her just because I enjoy her reading so much.

Hey BTW let me know if you ever do read City by Simak; iirc we'd talked about it a while ago.

Interesting! I'm not big on audiobooks as I tend to prefer the speed of reading and the imagery that my head evokes but there's definitely a lot to appreciate in a good narrator. I may have to give a James Marsters narrated Dresden Files novel at some point, for instance, because that sounds a lot like a Reese's Cup combination right there. But yes, I'll have to see how much the audiobook will set me back and I'll definitely drop a line if/when I pick up City and give it a read. I'm positive I've seen it on sale at the Kindle store at some point in the not too distant past so I view it as only a matter of time. :)

What is this place?

This website is a place for people who want to move past shady thinking and test their ideas in a court of people who don't all share the same biases. Our goal is to optimize for light, not heat; this is a group effort, and all commentators are asked to do their part.

The weekly Culture War threads host the most controversial topics and are the most visible aspect of The Motte. However, many other topics are appropriate here. We encourage people to post anything related to science, politics, or philosophy; if in doubt, post!

Check out The Vault for an archive of old quality posts. You are encouraged to crosspost these elsewhere.


Why are you called The Motte?

A motte is a stone keep on a raised earthwork common in early medieval fortifications. More pertinently, it's an element in a rhetorical move called a "Motte-and-Bailey", originally identified by philosopher Nicholas Shackel. It describes the tendency in discourse for people to move from a controversial but high value claim to a defensible but less exciting one upon any resistance to the former. He likens this to the medieval fortification, where a desirable land (the bailey) is abandoned when in danger for the more easily defended motte. In Shackel's words, "The Motte represents the defensible but undesired propositions to which one retreats when hard pressed."

On The Motte, always attempt to remain inside your defensible territory, even if you are not being pressed.


New post guidelines

If you're posting something that isn't related to the culture war, we encourage you to post a thread for it. A submission statement is highly appreciated, but isn't necessary for text posts or links to largely-text posts such as blogs or news articles; if we're unsure of the value of your post, we might remove it until you add a submission statement. A submission statement is required for non-text sources (videos, podcasts, images).

Culture war posts go in the culture war thread; all links must either include a submission statement or significant commentary. Bare links without those will be removed.

If in doubt, please post it!


Rules


Recommended Posts And Communities

Recommended Realtime Chats