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You're seriously arguing that the Iranians are happier with Shia fundamentalism imposed upon them? Bold I must say. Why all the mass protests over the years I wonder? (Including some specifically over veiling.)
Are you aware that Iran already has a famously high rate of plastic surgery?
Are you aware Iran has a famously high rate of brain drain?
Are you aware the Islamic government actually instituted policies to decrease the TFR and increase female education? (Whoops.)
Are you aware that Persians are not Arabs?
Are you aware that the extremist version of Shia Islam the Iranian Islamic regime adheres to increases conflict with basically all of its Sunni neighbors?
"Approximately" is doing a hell of a lot of work in the "approximately sane" evaluation.
Why all the mass protests in America or France? This signals that people have opinions, it isn’t a valid indicator of predicted happiness of social policies. I mean, toddlers and teenagers protest everything from authority, but they seldom are able to predict the longterm outcome of their desired proposals. This is the sin of democracy, that people mistake mass opinion for predictive ability.
Are you aware that Iran has half our suicide rate, one eighth of our drug overdose rate, a heavily subsidized and expansive healthcare system, and one third our intentional homicide rate? Probably not. Perhaps you’ll accuse them of cooking the books.
Yes, hence why I mentioned it: this doesn’t apply to the religious cohort, which is why they have an interest in maintaining their religious “extremism”. Otherwise they will all leave.
Of course but when it comes to the risk that Israel poses in the region, you can’t ignore that Iran being Islamic is helpful for speaking with other Islamic nations.
How does it compare to the US's homicide rate when broken down by race?
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You just obviously have no idea what you're talking about when you try to directly compare protests in the US or even France to those in Iran, before now or these ones. The dynamics are totally different when it's an actual police state.
Ah, this is the "Maduro is the true conservative" perspective. Do you know what "cherry picking" is?
They have hyperinflation ffs, among many other critical economic failures. Trying to find a few metrics where Iran might have a good stat doesn't overturn the obvious reality that it's a shithole country because it's been held back by economically illiterate leadership for nearly 50 years.
Ahahahahahaha. Iran has been and continues to be hated and feared by nearly all of its Sunni neighbors. You're trying to cherry pick an instance of slightly improved relations with the Saudis to defend the insane proposition that Iran's version of Shia Islam makes it easier to deal with its Sunni neighbors. Gulf Arab states have collaborated with the US and Israel against Iran.
Did you know that Iran and the Taliban have nearly gone to war a time or two?
What's next? ISIS has an easy time dealing with other Islamic states thanks to Islam?
Protestant and Catholic countries have always had better relations due to Christianity as a commonality?
These are pretty significant indicators. Especially if we want to “free” an “oppressed” population and deliver them American-Grade™️ Values. If our values lead to worse results for the average person than the average person in Iran, we should rethink our ability to improve other nations and instead consider why we’re doing so poorly. Their life expectancy is also tied with ours (and at a better trajectory) and they have half the obesity. The question of course is what they would look like without sanctions, with an extra 1 trillion.
The proposition is that, while an Islamic Iran has something important in common with its Muslim neighbors, a non-Islamic Iran would lose that card altogether and could never leave pariah status. This may not be a factor today but it may be a factor in the future. Consider from the Atlantic Council —
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/iransource/iran-saudi-arabia-china-deal-one-year/
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It's not imposed upon them, it's home-grown. They chose it in 1979.
Are you aware of the basic facts of the aftermath of the Islamic Revolution?
Familiar with buyer's remorse?
Capable of understanding its' been nearly 50 years and the theocratic regime does not have democratic legitimacy, since it's an illiberal, sham democracy?
Sure, lots of Death-To-America rallies, lots of Westernized Iranians who hadn't fled (among others) getting killed. Basically consolidation of power. Worked, too.
They don't need democratic legitimacy. With most of the people they have religious legitimacy, and for the malcontents they have the sword.
They executed a lot of commies and other insufficiently Islamic co-revolutionaries. Lots of the country immediately regretted taking out the Shah. That was decades ago and things only got worse.
Ok, so you agree then that the present regime is imposing Shia theocracy on its populace?
This hasn't been true for a long time.
They're a Shia theocratic regime ruling over Shiites. No imposing necessary.
So, why then are there millions of Iranians calling for regime change? This is just the latest, most serious iteration in a series of protests calling for reform.
Logically, you're making a pretty circular argument.
"The regime is legitimate because it's homegrown. Homegrown protests be damned."
"Iran is a Shia theocracy because it's made up of Shias. It's not imposed."
I don't know how many there are. But it's a country of 90 million. There could be a discontented 10% calling for regime change, and that would be 9 million people, and still the vast majority of the country could support the regime. Muslims just seem to like fundamentalist Islamic rule.
By that logic, the Russian people must have loved the Tsars too. After all, they were Orthodox autocrats in an Orthodox country. Clearly, that’s why the Russian Empire still exists and flourished up until this very day.
A far simpler explanation is that you’re speaking well beyond your knowledge of Muslims and Islamic societies, reducing decades of political, social, and cultural complexity to a single essentialist assumption.
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