site banner
naraburns  nihil supernum  7mo ago (text post)   28917 thread views

Israel-Gaza Megathread #1

This is a megathread for any posts on the conflict between (so far, and so far as I know) Hamas and the Israeli government, as well as related geopolitics. Culture War thread rules apply.

20
Top Bottom Old Controversial Comments
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

So you guys do know all these Palestinians will end up in Europe, right?

2.1 million is a lot of refugees. How does that measure up to previous crises, like Syria, etc? Is it effectively the same but all at once or a much bigger number?

Poland alone had more Ukrainian refugees, with about one million still staying right now (depending on how you count you will get different numbers).

Total count of Ukrainian refugees was about 5-6 million, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_refugee_crisis_(2022%E2%80%93present)

Obviously, refugee count is far from only impact. Palestinians are not going to Europe. Unless someone plays 7D chess and really wants right across Europe to win elections.

Unless someone plays 7D chess and really wants right across Europe to win elections.

Voting "right-wing" literally does not do anything in Western Europe. In Eastern-Europe "right-wing" voters still overwhelmingly support fighting Russia on behalf of the EU/NATO while simultaneously asking EU politely to stop sending migrants. The only way out of this endless All-Star loop Europe is stuck in is through violent revolution and rejection of democratic institutions.

Violent Revolution, so that Eastern Europe can do what? Bend over for Moscow? Balkanize into Rand-approved fiefdoms from sea to sea? You may not like the “right-wing” option, but I find it a more credible path to supporting your values than throwing your nation out the window.

Balkanize into Rand-approved fiefdoms from sea to sea?

Where do you think the verb 'balkanize' even come from?

but I find it a more credible path to supporting your values than throwing your nation out the window.

Good luck teaching half a billion Africans your 'values'. There is no European civilization without Europeans.

This is how 'right-wing' voting works.

current immigration level 100K/year

right-wing talking head: "The left wants to take in 500K immigrants per year, but we listen to the voters and will reduce immigration!"

immigration level becomes 200K/year

Rinse and repeat The people who control the media are the ones deciding what voters care about, and they will never give a platform to somebody further right than left-wingers 5 years ago.

I know exactly where “Balkanize” came from. I picked that to point out that a violent revolution in EE won’t create an ethnostate paradise. It’ll create a shithole, full of land mines and, if you’re lucky, NATO peacekeepers.

Balkan shitholes still look much better than what is probably in store for the future of Western Europe.

Fistulas are a kind of damage that is seldom seen in the developed world

In eastern Congo, however, the problem is practically an epidemic. When a truce was declared in the war there in 2003, so many cases began showing up that Western medical experts at first called it impossible—especially when local doctors declared that most of the fistulas they were seeing were the consequence of rapes. "No one wanted to believe it at first," says Lyn Lusi, manager of the HEAL Africa hospital (formerly called the Docs Hospital) in the eastern Congo city of Goma. "When our doctors first published their results, in 2003, this was unheard of."

More references to look up: necklacing;

documentary Africa Addio

Balkan shitholes

Are you even aware with current state of Balkan countries?

More comments

What is this place?

This website is a place for people who want to move past shady thinking and test their ideas in a court of people who don't all share the same biases. Our goal is to optimize for light, not heat; this is a group effort, and all commentators are asked to do their part.

The weekly Culture War threads host the most controversial topics and are the most visible aspect of The Motte. However, many other topics are appropriate here. We encourage people to post anything related to science, politics, or philosophy; if in doubt, post!

Check out The Vault for an archive of old quality posts. You are encouraged to crosspost these elsewhere.


Why are you called The Motte?

A motte is a stone keep on a raised earthwork common in early medieval fortifications. More pertinently, it's an element in a rhetorical move called a "Motte-and-Bailey", originally identified by philosopher Nicholas Shackel. It describes the tendency in discourse for people to move from a controversial but high value claim to a defensible but less exciting one upon any resistance to the former. He likens this to the medieval fortification, where a desirable land (the bailey) is abandoned when in danger for the more easily defended motte. In Shackel's words, "The Motte represents the defensible but undesired propositions to which one retreats when hard pressed."

On The Motte, always attempt to remain inside your defensible territory, even if you are not being pressed.


New post guidelines

If you're posting something that isn't related to the culture war, we encourage you to post a thread for it. A submission statement is highly appreciated, but isn't necessary for text posts or links to largely-text posts such as blogs or news articles; if we're unsure of the value of your post, we might remove it until you add a submission statement. A submission statement is required for non-text sources (videos, podcasts, images).

Culture war posts go in the culture war thread; all links must either include a submission statement or significant commentary. Bare links without those will be removed.

If in doubt, please post it!


Rules


Recommended Posts And Communities

Recommended Realtime Chats