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ZorbaTHut  1yr ago (text post)   35203 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of September 19, 2022

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I think you are weakmanning my argument by boiling it down to "just because worse things exist doesn't mean my complaints are invalid".

My argument is basically if OP has enough mental energy to worry about "how his descendants will look like 200 years later", I can just about guarantee you OP isn't worrying about his descendants enough right now in the present.

Unless OP's life is that good that he doesn't have to worry about his kids but his kids;kids;kids.

Edit - OP is falling into the midwit trap. Which is dispensing simple wisdom for overly complicated theory.

low iq - "Just live a good life yourself ,man"

midwit - "The demographic trends now show that within n years, the expected gdp/capita is going to be y"

high iq - "Just live a good life yourself, man. Culture is created bottom up from the individual. Don't lament that which is outside your control and outside your understanding. If everyone seriously aims to live a good life himself, society will be good. Live in a way that inspires your community and kids to follow, and culture will create itself, and your kids will perpetuate and spread it. "

I'm arguing for strength not weakness, in the face of adversity.

the midwit trap

Before I studied the Zen, the mountain was just a mountain.

When I was a student of the Zen, the mountain was more than just a mountain.

After I mastered the Zen, the mountain was again just a mountain.

Calling people "midwits" is the IAmVerySmart way to say "You're stupid." Don't. You aren't qualified to pass judgment on anyone else's intelligence, even if you think you can discern this from a post or two.

Didnt call OP a midwit. I made a reference to a meme that pokes fun at complicated but ultimately shallow theorizing.

https://philo.substack.com/p/the-midwit-trap

The memes name is besides the point.

Love the article, but every time I read it, I have to point out the correct “midwit meme” for pi is indeed 3.14 on both sides, since most measurements do need the .14 as significant digits to avoid significant error.

My argument is basically if OP has enough mental energy to worry about "how his descendants will look like 200 years later", I can just about guarantee you OP isn't worrying about his descendants enough right now in the present.

If you're arguing that "how they look doesn't matter", sure. But "plant a tree that will mature after you die", and his descendants' lives in 200 years certainly do matter, and worrying about how AI will affect future people, or doing something about it, is important.

Can you please not use the midwit meme? You might as well just say “You’re a retard”, but for some reason the mods tolerate one but would never tolerate the other

Also this might just be me, but I automatically assume anyone who uses that word thinks they are demonstrating high intelligence by declaring anyone of average intelligence stupid compared to them. And I assume those people are compensating for the insecurity they feel about their average intelligence.

If you can decouple the "wit" from the midwit meme, it's a very congent vehicle for the idea 'that complicated is not better than simple'. That "wit" is ranked on clarity/coherence of ideas as opposed surface level complexity.

So no, I quite like the meme.

It just leads to the exchange currently taking place between you and 6tjk which amounts to “No you’re the midwit”. You could have made the point without the meme and it would have been better taken

The "low IQ midwit high IQ" meme is awfully midwit itself. Your supposedly "high IQ" viewpoint is just a platitude that implies third world countries suck because the population just doesn't try hard enough to live well. The meme format isn't a good argument, it's just an attempt to say "well some imaginary super geniuses agree with me, so it's okay that my viewpoint seems to be wrong!"

These "imaginary supergeniuses" I'm invoking are the same people who built the culture OP laments the loss of.

My proposal will help with OP's current psyche and actually contributes a moonshot chance alleviating OP's fears. What is your proposal? Is it lost on everyone that the ideology most damaging to the west (wokism) is perpetuated by mostly... white people?

I'm telling OP to fight the enemy within. Metaphorically and literally.

i mean you're assuming the fear is, in fact, false. But if the claimed issue is in fact accurate, as OP believes it is, then ... well, it is, fear or not.

No, you are telling him to bury his head in the sand. The people who built the culture OP laments the loss of were comically racist compared to almost every modern Westerner, and did not even allow non-whites to naturalize instead of throwing open the floodgates.

In an all-white America, the Republican candidate would have won every Presidential election since 1964. Anti-white politics, obviously, would be substantially attenuated in a more white country. Some whites being successful anti-whites doesn't make a difference.

The people who built the culture OP laments the loss of were comically racist compared to almost every modern Westerner, and did not even allow non-whites to naturalize instead of throwing open the floodgates.

Everyone was comically racist during those times. You are committing the non central fallacy. Saying as if the racism had anything to do with the greatness of the culture they created.

You know who else is comically racist? Just about every civilization/culture ever. The Arabs, The Turks, The Chinese, The Aztecs.

That's just noise in the signal.

In an all-white America, the Republican candidate would have won every Presidential election since 1964. Anti-white politics, obviously, would be substantially attenuated in a more white country. Some whites being successful anti-whites doesn't make a difference.

And ?

Why are Republicans the benchmark? The median Republican is much closer to the median democrat than you, fyi.

No, you are telling him to bury his head in the sand.

Ok, what should OP do? I'm yet to see you propose a solution.

I'm committing no such fallacy. You are the one arguing the "builders of OP's culture" would have ignored demographics, when in fact the "builders of OP's culture" worked hard to destroy foreign cultures and bar outsiders from entry.

It's a benchmark because Republican politicians are very obviously less anti-white than Democratic politicians.

I'm committing no such fallacy. You are the one arguing the "builders of OP's culture" would have ignored demographics, when in fact the "builders of OP's culture" worked hard to destroy foreign cultures and bar outsiders from entry.

And how does this relate to the good culture? Every culture did this.

Until you can tell me why them doing it was good but other cultures doing it was also not good, it is a non central fallacy. It's not unique to whites.

Anti-white politics, obviously, would be substantially attenuated in a more white country.

  1. Whites are the most anti-white people. The battle is cultural, not political. People become anti white because they read about it on twitter not because they follow vote democrat, most people don't vote.

  2. If not being anti white is the only concern in the world, then sure. But republicans do plenty of things that makes the founding fathers turn in their graves, like printing gazillions of dollars. Or starting wars and losing trillions.

R vs D are irrelevant to this conversation, they are both largely dogshit. So back to;

Ok, what should OP do? I'm yet to see you propose a solution.

Let's say with republicans around in your counter factual world, there is no anti white rhetoric, but the culture that remains is a shadow of its past self. Is that preferable to you?

Or am I correct in my proposal that its culture that needs to be preserved and created at the individual level?

And how does this relate to the good culture? Every culture did this.

Until you can tell me why them doing it was good but other cultures doing it was also not good, it is a non central fallacy. It's not unique to whites.

That makes it even more ridiculous that you are recommending him to not do the thing that every culture ever has done based on the argument that "culture builders would have done this."

That makes it even more ridiculous that you are recommending him to not do the thing that every culture ever has done based on the argument that "culture builders would have done this."

On the contrary, @f3zinker is recommending that he do the thing that every culture ever has done has has done to perpetuate itself. Stop worrying about stupid bullshit and instead worry about making babies and making sure those babies live long enough to make babies of their own.

You are being ridiculous. As an individual he can't invade countries or single-handedly change culture. He can only change HIS lifestyle and HIS perspective. You keep on failing to propose a solution, what can OP do?? I will not continue this discussion further until you have proposed an alternative that is applicable to the individual and does not depend on policies laid out 60 years ago. Sorry it has to be this way, but I am constrained by the PRESENT time and place (and the world we live in), in my advice (and policy positions).

  1. Also every culture practiced slavery, the west put an end to that. Which also coincided with their economic ascent. Should they have continued it? Should they bring it back? Nothing related to the argument just want to guage how much you are going to commit to the "thing that every culture has done" larp. Or do you actually operate on principles ?

    2 . Also the majority of cultures did not live in a time where international commerce/trade wasn't the behemot it is today and the Internet did not exist. A country can do "what a majority of cultures have done for ever" they would just be sanctioned to hell.

I ask you once again. What should OP do as individual?

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