site banner
naraburns  nihil supernum  2yr ago (text post)   32892 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of January 16, 2023

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

13
Top Bottom Old Controversial Comments
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

There's something to carbs making people sluggish. I had a bad habit of substituting cookies for cooking, and I'd eat like 8 ounces and then feel sleepy, as if I'd drunk a beer. Stopped buying that kind of snack, my self control is not good.

Overeating makes people sluggish. Just it's easiest to overeat when done with carbs. After a good 3 pound steak I am satiated up to the next evening.

Haha, I feel like this replicates every one of those conversations I've had. Eating a half pound of cookies is absolutely wild to me. Just don't do that! It's obviously bad for you! Just eat one cookie, or maybe two! I realize that in practice people have very different impulses around these sorts of things, so this is a completely useless suggestion, but it seems like the heart of every anti-carb conversation winds up being people going absolutely bonkers on things that I just eat a little bit of and then walk away from. Admittedly, impulse control is a hell of a lot easier with steak and eggs than with a giant pile of fried rice.

Haha, I feel like this replicates every one of those conversations I've had. Eating a half pound of cookies is absolutely wild to me. Just don't do that! It's obviously bad for you! Just eat one cookie, or maybe two!

Cookies are like that. I love cookies, but they completely ignore my satiety centers and hit only the pleasure ones. I used to have some cookies and a piece of candy after a meal, and when I tried to cut down on superfluous carbs, I realized I would feel hungry for something sweet after wolfing down a few cookies, but not after skipping cookies and eating a single chocolate candy.

My wife and I work around this by completely banning having a cookie by yourself in the house. If you want one, you have to get one for the other, too. This means you have both the impulse control of each person as well as making it relatively rare for both people to be craving cookies at the same time, so it's very rare for us to have more than one or two each. I can't think of the last time we've done anything even close to having a whole box in one sitting.

It also helps we don't keep particularly delectable cookies like flavored Oreos in the house at all, anymore.

I just switched to protein bars. I've found a brand that makes organoleptically great bars (with "chocolate" glazing and "caramel" and a blend of non-caloric sweeteners that works for me) and eating one triggers that "had dessert" switch in me.

You want me to spend 25 minutes fixing dinner when I can just down a liter of milk and half a pound of cookies and get back to whatever unnaturally rewarding thing* I was doing with the Skinner box on my desk ?

Ha!

*I feel the meme is correct, if you play a game where, if you do very well you see the message 'target destroyed' flash on the screen, you'll probably enjoy watching videos with that message rather a lot.

Milk is great though! If you insist on literally prep replace the cookies with bread or something, perhaps rye, which is great with milk, and plenty of fruit/veg are edible without cooking. Fixing dinner doesn't need to take time though, throwing some potatoes and meat in an oven and browsing the web for 30min is a lot easier than 30min spent on making a 'real meal'

But still not as easy as lying on the couch, cramming cookies into your mouth until you can't close your lips, and then pouring milk and baileys into your mouth so that the cookies all disintegrate inside your mouth! And then doing that again and again until you pass out.

Admittedly, impulse control is a hell of a lot easier with steak and eggs than with a giant pile of fried rice.

Not necessarily. Someone who might consider an entire American sized large (14" dia) pizza as something for two proper meals but probably consumed as one long meal might be equally undeterred from treating a 40oz porterhouse in the same way.

very fatty 2lb+ pieces of meat are very filling and become actively unappetizing once you've eaten 'enough' in my experience

I'm exactly that sort of pizza eater. On keto, a 14oz steak with some veggies on a mostly empty stomach is plenty. It genuinely feels like a totally different experience with hunger. Like the conversion from hunger to mere appetite just doesn’t happen.

What is this place?

This website is a place for people who want to move past shady thinking and test their ideas in a court of people who don't all share the same biases. Our goal is to optimize for light, not heat; this is a group effort, and all commentators are asked to do their part.

The weekly Culture War threads host the most controversial topics and are the most visible aspect of The Motte. However, many other topics are appropriate here. We encourage people to post anything related to science, politics, or philosophy; if in doubt, post!

Check out The Vault for an archive of old quality posts. You are encouraged to crosspost these elsewhere.


Why are you called The Motte?

A motte is a stone keep on a raised earthwork common in early medieval fortifications. More pertinently, it's an element in a rhetorical move called a "Motte-and-Bailey", originally identified by philosopher Nicholas Shackel. It describes the tendency in discourse for people to move from a controversial but high value claim to a defensible but less exciting one upon any resistance to the former. He likens this to the medieval fortification, where a desirable land (the bailey) is abandoned when in danger for the more easily defended motte. In Shackel's words, "The Motte represents the defensible but undesired propositions to which one retreats when hard pressed."

On The Motte, always attempt to remain inside your defensible territory, even if you are not being pressed.


New post guidelines

If you're posting something that isn't related to the culture war, we encourage you to post a thread for it. A submission statement is highly appreciated, but isn't necessary for text posts or links to largely-text posts such as blogs or news articles; if we're unsure of the value of your post, we might remove it until you add a submission statement. A submission statement is required for non-text sources (videos, podcasts, images).

Culture war posts go in the culture war thread; all links must either include a submission statement or significant commentary. Bare links without those will be removed.

If in doubt, please post it!


Rules


Recommended Posts And Communities

Recommended Realtime Chats