site banner
PaperclipPerfector  4d ago (text post)   15279 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of April 13, 2026

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

3
Top Bottom Old Controversial Comments
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

Sam Altman's bad week continues, as a car stopped and appears to have fired a gun at the Russian Hill home of OpenAI’s CEO.

OpenAI CEO Sam Altman’s home appears to have been the target of a second attack Sunday morning, a mere two days after a 20-year-old man allegedly threw a Molotov cocktail at the property, The Standard has learned.

The San Francisco Police Department announced (opens in new tab) the arrest of two suspects, Amanda Tom, 25, and Muhamad Tarik Hussein, 23, who were booked for negligent discharge.

It appears that, if measured by deed, Mr. Altman may be in contention for the title of most hated business executive in the country.

Unless I am profoundly misinformed about the base rate of assassination attempts on tech CEOs, it appears AI anxiety has apparently reached a precipitation point among American youth, to the point where discontent is crystalizing into direct action. I've seen this in my personal life. My youngest brother is a bright kid - top of his class, eagle scout, 1400+ on his SATs as a junior, the whole shebang. He's completely given up on his original goal of going to college for something software-related, and he's not only adrift about what he's going to do with his future, but he's angry about it. I hope he has a support network sufficient to keep him on the right track, but I don't like what I see.

I'm not exactly old, but I'm sure as hell not young either. For those of you who are 25 or under, what does it feel like on the ground right now?

top of his class, eagle scout, 1400+ on his SATs as a junior, the whole shebang.

My first immediate thought is Americans live on easy mode. For East Asians, top of graduating class would mean minimum 1500.

But what has that gotten East Asians? It would seem they prefer to move to the United States, and Americans do not prefer to move to China. Perhaps over-studying is a form of defection against society, and it being predominant lowers creative output, leading to a worse economy than a counterfactual society.

It would seem they prefer to move to the United States, and Americans do not prefer to move to China.

Not sure if that's true these days. We need to search up let's say where the top 10k gaokao testers go over the years. I believe the increased scrutiny ("Are you a chinese spy?") and increasingly hostile culture against China lead to many Chinese deciding to go back to their country. I know in Vietnam that it was a minor controversy where all the winners of a nationally televised academic contest all became Australian nationals (the winning prize is a full ride scholarship to an Australian university)

The vast majority have not gone back to China, and the other direction you didn't address. Americans don't move to China. Why is that, if China is so great?

There is (or more like was) a big expat community in China, I'm sure if they could they would have loved to take roots there. China just doesn't allow much immigration if at all. The supply just isn't there even if there is demand.

How big is it compared to the expat community of Chinese in the United States?

According to 2020 Chinese census, China has 1,430,695 immigrants, dividing between 845,697 foreign nationals and 584,998 residents of Hong Kong, Macao and Taiwan.[1] As of 2023, there are around 12,000 foreigners with permanent residency in China.[2]

As of 2023, there are approximately 5.5 million Chinese Americans in the United States, making them the largest Asian origin population in the country.

Despite the US being 1/3 of the population of China, there are 4 times more Chinese immigrants living in the United States than all immigrants living in China.

How do you explain that if China is so great?

I just reviewed my comments. I should have said "Not sure if Chinese prefer migrating to America is all true these days". Look, I don't disagree with you. I am an immigrant to the US myself and certainly think it's a better place for me and that the place would be better with me in it. And about the dynamics of immigration, China has never been welcoming and has a strong cultural and social identity on what it means to be Chinese, not to mention the process sucks even harder than the US in some ways. If one looks at immigration by percentage of population, China stands out in both how powerful/rich it is compared to its immigration population. But the sentiment is changing and that's what I meant by pointing out that "Not sure if that's true these days". We've all read the many posts about Deepseek and Chinese tech companies, they are certainly full of talents and people who isn't really leaving anymore. Would they if they could? maybe. Target, desire, opportunity, the triangle of crime is a great way to explain how people make choices anyway. Opportunities for foreigners in China since the CPC came to power has remained few relatively even if they have the target and desire, but opportunities and desire for Chinese nationals to stay have increased.

But what has that gotten East Asians? It would seem they prefer to move to the United States, and Americans do not prefer to move to China. Perhaps over-studying is a form of defection against society, and it being predominant lowers creative output, leading to a worse economy than a counterfactual society

I think it can still shake out in surprising ways. China led in just three of 64 technologies in 2003–20074 but is now the lead country in 57 of 64 technologies in 2019–2023, increasing its lead from our rankings last year (2018–2022), where it was leading in 52 technologies.. I certainly read a ton of chinese webnovels and to me the Chinese authors are very very creative. The weight of Chinese population requires both US + Europe combined to counterbalance. Xi is iron-fisted, but Chinese people as a whole are prosperous and growing.

I am most worried for China about the demographic collapse, the gender gap. I thought China actually handled the real estate bubble well. I am of the belief that American people are still angry that no one really got punished for the 2008 crisis (that they got chumped) and that anger animates all the elections since. I don't like China's lack of freedoms, China homogeneous view of society, etc. but I don't discount that for much of its population that the balance is fine.

You are missing the point: nobody likes China, not even the Chinese. They flee from China at a rate much higher than people flee to China. Therefore, your ethnic chauvinism is misplaced. You said:

My first immediate thought is Americans live on easy mode. For East Asians, top of graduating class would mean minimum 1500.

This is not a good thing. This is why people don't like China or Chinese immigration. Studying too much is selfish and doesn't benefit society. It's bad behavior. It should not be celebrated.

More comments

I've heard a few stories about really smart people on the margins moving to China and being wildly rewarded. Mostly white male engineers who felt DEI-limited in the states. Inversely though I know basically nobody learning Chinese. It's extremely uncommon relative to the number of people predicting that China is about to take over the world.

I believe the increased scrutiny ("Are you a chinese spy?") and increasingly hostile culture against China lead to many Chinese deciding to go back to their country.

Not to mention the near-impossibility of dating as an East Asian male fob in the US, especially in the major tech hubs (Bay Area, Seattle)

They could always try dating ADoS women.

I (and they) would much rather go back to China

What is this place?

This website is a place for people who want to move past shady thinking and test their ideas in a court of people who don't all share the same biases. Our goal is to optimize for light, not heat; this is a group effort, and all commentators are asked to do their part.

The weekly Culture War threads host the most controversial topics and are the most visible aspect of The Motte. However, many other topics are appropriate here. We encourage people to post anything related to science, politics, or philosophy; if in doubt, post!

Check out The Vault for an archive of old quality posts. You are encouraged to crosspost these elsewhere.


Why are you called The Motte?

A motte is a stone keep on a raised earthwork common in early medieval fortifications. More pertinently, it's an element in a rhetorical move called a "Motte-and-Bailey", originally identified by philosopher Nicholas Shackel. It describes the tendency in discourse for people to move from a controversial but high value claim to a defensible but less exciting one upon any resistance to the former. He likens this to the medieval fortification, where a desirable land (the bailey) is abandoned when in danger for the more easily defended motte. In Shackel's words, "The Motte represents the defensible but undesired propositions to which one retreats when hard pressed."

On The Motte, always attempt to remain inside your defensible territory, even if you are not being pressed.


New post guidelines

If you're posting something that isn't related to the culture war, we encourage you to post a thread for it. A submission statement is highly appreciated, but isn't necessary for text posts or links to largely-text posts such as blogs or news articles; if we're unsure of the value of your post, we might remove it until you add a submission statement. A submission statement is required for non-text sources (videos, podcasts, images).

Culture war posts go in the culture war thread; all links must either include a submission statement or significant commentary. Bare links without those will be removed.

If in doubt, please post it!


Rules


Recommended Posts And Communities

Recommended Realtime Chats