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PaperclipPerfector  14hr ago (text post)   1997 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of June 8, 2026

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I'm still somewhat shocked at the sheer amount these women are making.

Meanwhile, in the gospel of Mark:

And when the daughter of the said Herodias came in, and danced, and pleased Herod and them that sat with him, the king said unto the damsel, Ask of me whatsoever thou wilt, and I will give it thee. And he sware unto her, Whatsoever thou shalt ask of me, I will give it thee, unto the half of my kingdom.

And of course, long before that, in the book of Esther:

Then said the king unto her, What wilt thou, queen Esther? and what is thy request? it shall be even given thee to the half of the kingdom.

Going by memory: that's Herod's stepdaughter fathered by his dead brother and I believe aunt through incestuous marriage. He then married his widowed aunt/sister-in-law. John the Baptist was killed for criticizing this doubly forbidden marriage; as young Salome demands his head after dancing. She's not a courtesan getting the king horny, she's his stepdaughter. Unless you imagined some higher grosser level of incest where he goes for his aunt and niece.

She's not a courtesan getting the king horny, she's his stepdaughter

Historian estimate she was a literal child as well. Later writers invented the titillating stuff with the veils, whereas the original story was that Herod saw a little girl do a dance, thought it was cute and promised her anything she wanted (expecting her to not ask for much, since she's a child).

Her mother then made her ask for John the Baptist's head.

This exchange reminds me of an old poem by the Finland-Swede Bertel Gripenberg. I permit myself a very self-indulgent excursion.

Begär vad du vill, Salome, jag kan icke säga nej, och bad du om Döparens huvud, vid Gud, jag nekade ej! Vad äro himlens profeter mot jorden fagraste mö! En vink av din hand, Salome, och Döparen måste dö!

En Gud som vi icke känna, en himmel som ingen sett, och hotande ord som larma om straffet och helvetet, vem bytte väl ej all denna bedrägliga sagoskatt mot jordens skönaste kvinna och livets ljuvaste natt!

In my own rough and quick translation:

Ask what you wish, Salome, I cannot tell you no, and if you asked for the Baptist's head, by God, I'd make it so! What are the prophets of heaven to the fairest maiden of all! A sign of your hand, Salome, and the Baptist must fall!

A God we do not know, a heaven which none can tell, and darkened words that threaten us, with punishment and hell. Who would not give up all of this fraudulent fairy-tale gold, for the fairest women on Earth in sweetest pleasure-night to hold!

In practice, do you think either could have actually gotten "half of the kingdom" if they said that? Or is that effectively an indirect marriage proposal?

Half? You can get a man to give up his entire kingdom!

"A horse, a horse! My kingdom for a horse!" -Richard III

The niche tastes cost the most.

Herodias' daughter got the head of John the Baptist, which by most accounts is worth rather more than half the kingdom. (Note that this isn't Herod the Great, it's his younger son Herod Antipas who ruled a postage-stamp size kingdom in Galilee as a client of the Roman Empire).

Can you unpack some of the context here for me? You’re just saying women suck essentially?

No, he’s saying there’s nothing new about women gaining obscene amounts of money/power if they can suck well (so to speak)

I'm saying women extracting ludicrous amounts of wealth from men simply by being hot is something that's been going on for millennia.

Ok, fair. I'm aware it's not necessarily anything new under the sun. I suppose it just feels extremely brazen at the moment, but hey what do I know. Apparently it used to be pretty much the same.

Courtesans have been a thing forever.

Yeah, it's a rare positive sign for modern sexual morality that many of us have forgotten the distinction between lower class prostitutes and upper class ones and assume the latter doesn’t exist.

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