This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
Given access to logs, metrics, etc. I expect Claude would in fact be able to fix this.
We have already exited the "nothing happens" condition given present capabilities. The graybeards are much better off acting in a staff+ capacity using LLMs than writing code themselves. The question of what to do with junior engineers is an interesting one.
That's easy. Fire the greys and replace them with juniors that have claude. Same productivity, half the wage.
Juniors should be incapable of operating at the scope and scale of seniors. Their tasks must be small in scope and complexity to have a hope of success. Fortunately seniors can guide them through such work.
Some people are going to learn these lessons the hard way.
I guess I'm a senior then because I do maximum scope and complexity at my company. Strangely a lot of firms still deny I'm senior and want me to in practice be 30 years old for considering me for such a role.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
It is presently unclear if a junior engineer who has only ever used Claude can become a graybeard.
Presently unclear to whom? Not to everybody, surely?
To many, including me.
Of course. But does that makes it presently unclear, in a general sense, or just unclear to you and people like you? What if it is clear to me?
It does make it presently unclear in a general sense.
Then nothing. Do you want a cookie?
Why is it that if something is unclear to you, it is unclear, while if it is clear to me, all I get is a cookie? Are you superior to me?
Because I hold the consensus position on this question.
More options
Context Copy link
If it's clear to you, you can hire a bunch of junior engineers for your project and have them become greybeards for half the wage. Then you get more than a cookie.
Otherwise you only get a cookie, which is still more than being unclear (a whole cookie), so I don't know what injustice you see here.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
Eh.
If companies are still employing software engineers (and they all are) then I’d say we’re mostly in “nothing happens” territory. It might be a revolutionary technology, the greatest revolution since the internet or even the computer. But if people are still going to work then, how different are things, really?
It is too early to be confident. Many people in FAANG have no idea how to use AI effectively and many others refuse on principle. Massive layoffs (20%+) are unlikely due to reasons of political economy despite the staggering amount of deadwood at these companies. It will take a long time for these ships to turn, we are still in the early stages of diffusion.
People went to work before the industrial revolution and people went to work after. Perhaps your opinion is that "nothing happened" during the industrial revolution; let's say I disagree.
I thought they were the best? Is this why my VSCode is eating half a macbook pro battery in 3 hours?
They definitely like to think so. Empirically they are the most money and status oriented at this point. Whether that translates into technical skill is unclear but it probably has some positive correlation.
More options
Context Copy link
While some are good people, they are on average not sending their best.
More options
Context Copy link
There is no "M" in FAANG.
You are technically correct.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
I legitimately don’t care if AI ends the human race or not, I will simply just be so so thankful to whatever deity exists when I won’t have to hear this phrase anymore.
Both are valid perspectives.
Did the industrial revolution change everything? Of course it did. The world is entirely different now. Drop an average person back in the 1500s and they’d probably have no idea how to survive. But, on the other hand, did it really change everything? Perhaps not. People still work, get sick, and die, same as they always did. I guess if that changes then we’ll really be in new territory.
Amazing that the invention of fire or even the advent of intelligent life on this planet (using "people" loosely) didn't 'change everything' by this definition. Tough crowd!
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link