This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
I'm just glad that we're finally past the totally clueless people insisting AI is not even useful for coding and are on to the next stage of grief we have to drag people through on the way to acceptance that big Yud has been right the entire time. The faux cynical takes that the labs at the absolute cutting edge of this are fudding their own product to the dismay of the sitting president in some insane 8 dimensional chess move because they want to be regulated by Bernie Sanders is so plainly retarded that it can't possibly last very long.
I may yet write a top level post about bad epistemics and Ed Zitron. Somehow the man has about 100,000 subscribers on substack despite there being entire webpages assembled of his false predictions.
There's still quite a few people waiting for the bubble pop. We're way past the point of it being a reasonable opinion I agree, yet there are so many who still believe.
The embittering part of it all is that I wish I could agree with the accelerationists, it'd be so beautiful, and I'm not even full Yudd in that I think there's a very good chance Alignment ends up being tractable and even might go well automatically. But I just can't stomach ten or twenty percent chance that everyone dies. It can still be beautiful even with a pause, we can still cure cancer and fight back against aging and probably end all toil. But it'd be so nice to not have to feel trepidation about this.
One of the things that safety-pilled me was thinking about just how much work there still is to do maximising the human benefit of existing models - society still hasn't adapted to a world where an AI assistant with the intelligence of a smart intern is available at a consumer-SaaS price point. As a trivial example, there should be an insanely great agent harness (think Apple-tier) which allows my grandmother to enlist an AI agent to deal with the medical bureaucracy without my having to set things up for her. Part of the reason why this hasn't been built is that the underlying models are improving too fast and too unpredictably to make building it a good business.
A world in which training of new models stopped tomorrow would still see more tech-driven social change in the next decade than we have seen in any previous decade of human history.
The personal assistant who knows my preferences and priorities, can keep track of birthdays, navigate buerocracy and keep tabs on the local job and real estate market will be a very valuable product/service indeed.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link