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naraburns  nihil supernum  1yr ago (text post)   29311 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of February 6, 2023

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Did the US blow up the Nord Stream Pipeline?

https://seymourhersh.substack.com/p/how-america-took-out-the-nord-stream

That was linked to me and it appeals to my sense of - conspiracy? warmongering? ... But I also don't really understand if it could be true.

What's the consensus here about the pipeline?

(I don't really even care if we discuss the article, it's long and I don't know who the person is - just interested in all kinds of thoughts)

No.

Big prior against the US explicitly blowing up energy infrastructure. Bigger prior against the evidence only showing up on a random Substack. Sets off my “epistemic learned helplessness” flags.

I’d change my mind if mainstream outlets can point to a smoking gun.

a random Substack

A substack of one of the most decorated and impactful journalists of all time is "random".

OK.

I’d change my mind if mainstream outlets can point to a smoking gun.

So, a genetic fallacy then.

I really don't like the rat-adjacent obsession with the idea of "priors". It's just a fancy way of saying "I believe X" or "I don't believe X" and acting like that somehow means the burden of proof is on the opposition.

I’d change my mind if mainstream outlets can point to a smoking gun.

Sure much like with the Twitter Files, it'll be a conspiracy theory until it becomes undeniable, at which point we'll hear "this is nothing new, why are you talking about it?".

If the OP wants personal opinions, priors are appropriate. I don’t believe the US did it, or that Sy Hersh would be scooping it on substack if we did. As such, yeah, I’m claiming the burden of proof is on the opposition—if they care about convincing me.

the difference between prior assumptions and beliefs is that priors are expected to update or change with new info whereas beliefs tend to be much closer to permanent. Its a way for people to say "i currently believe X but i'm not married to the conclusion" in fewer words.

That said its also the designated socially acceptable space to traffic obvious personal bias into an otherwise ratty conversation, so i do understand being annoyed by it. "those aren't my unsupported dogmatic opinions, those are just my priors"

It's funny because netstack was basically saying "I believe the US will never blow up energy infrastructure" and "I don't believe in evidence from substack."

Counter. At the time the US didn’t want to claim responsibility. It’s a slow escalation. I wouldn’t be surprised if this is an official leak. Wait a bit and people don’t care as much. Leak a non sourced story thru a guy whose sometimes right but comes off conspiratorial. So you slowly build up the idea that we did it. From we make the most sense. Then conspiracy guy says how we did it. Then a year from now some more official backing.

That’s kind of how I would do it. Day one we did it would have escalated it too much. But as a spook this is about the timeline I would pursue.

While I agree it is unlikely, Sy Hersh isn’t exactly a random substack.

That said, this is thinly sourced, would indicate criminal behavior by multiple people in the executive branch, and an act of aggression against a warring nuclear power. I think Biden is an idiot, but I have to think the joint chiefs would have stopped this.

I think the joint chiefs are idiots and Biden is the only sane man.

Although it’s worth mentioning that I’ve always held the view that the nord stream pipeline was blown up by the US.

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