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PaperclipPerfector  1mo ago (text post)   28331 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of March 11, 2024

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As of this time @HlynkaCG has been permabanned. I'm posting this message at the top of the thread, because its not really for Hlynka, its for the community to know. There were a few different posts I could have chosen in the modqueue, and many of them were too buried to be visible. The mod team has given him repeated warnings and bans. And I personally reached out to him last ban to warn him that a permaban was likely coming if this behavior continued.

I mostly do not feel this is a good thing, but it is a necessary thing. Hlynka had quite a few quality contributions, and I don't think I was alone in appreciating his often unique (for themotte) perspective. But he repeatedly did it in a way that just wasn't acceptable for the rules around here.

I would like people to have a few takeaways:

  1. No one on this forum is infinitely excused of bad behavior. Having quality contributions and providing a unique viewpoint might get you some additional leeway, but our patience isn't unlimited.
  2. The mods do read and participate here. We know when someone is starting to abuse that leeway. We know when there is frustration about it.
  3. We do try to be deliberate and slow about things. It can feel real shitty when a cabal of people meet in secret to discuss your punishment and they decide permanent banishment is the solution. For longtime users that have put in the time and effort to be a part of the community here we don't lightly jump to permanent bans as a solution.

Please keep any discussion civil.

no, this not a correctional facility and you are not correctional officers

we like hlynka and are looking forward to his contributions under his new name

  • -18

You're correct that this isn't a correctional facility, but you're mistaken if there isn't moderation involved in keeping our tiny enclave in the internet wastes that way.

Anyone who doesn't like it is welcome to leave. There plenty of other forums out there. The mods here still take pains to maintain the Mandate of Heaven approval of the supermajority of the users, since without them, we'd be a glorified day drinking club and Zorba's AWS bill would be significantly less justified, if a lot smaller.

But that's that for Hlynka. Making an alt after being permabanned doesn't work as well as you'd like, especially for such a colorful character as Hlynka. Anyone can tell it's him even behind seven layers of VPNs, and anyway, I think he has more of a martyr complex and feels vindicated rather than desiring to sneak in under a new alias.

Anyone who doesn't like it is welcome to leave. There plenty of other forums out there.

This line was worn out 5 years ago. There is no where else to go.

Yeah that's a boatload of responsibility for you shepherds who didn't sign up for that job - but even the birdwatchers started banning each other years ago for political incorrectness. There is no where else to go.

If Hlynka (me lol jk) is gone from here for good, he's just gone for good. Damascus Steel. Greek Fire. Roman Concrete.

Or, off our grid at least, which is the same thing. How many OG's does it take to determine how many angels fit on the head of a pin? Because we're trimming the muscle from the bone real quick if Hlynka isn't able to do his Hlynjinx anymore. And I genuinely don't even like the guy. I've met Mr 'when I was in the service' a lot in my life, and wouldn't think he added much, if he weren't the only one still doing it!

Here's to all the posts to which we have to look forward on the newest thing in san francisco nimbyism, how ai is gay now and forever, and why Trump is really done this time

This line was worn out 5 years ago. There is no where else to go.

There are plenty of places to go. There may not be any places that are run according to your specific desires.

You are right that this place is small enough that every permabanned regular costs us something. Members aren't easily replaced. But that cannot become a justification for letting people repeatedly stomp on the norms that are the reason this place exists. No one's contributions are that irreplaceable.

Also, your trolling (e.g. reporting your own post as "fake and gay") is not clever. If you want to leave, just leave. If you want to be banned, just say so.

Everyone's contributions are that irreplaceable. This is the most self-selected self-sorted self-assembled group of freethinkers left on planet earth that's not buried in a telegram feed somewhere impenetrable.

Everyone's contributions are that irreplaceable.

No, they're not. I'm glad you think this place is so special and irreplaceable, but the reality is that all Internet communities die eventually, and people will move on, and very few people here (you and me included) are that special. So regarding your argument, that we should stop banning people for being trolls or uncivil, that isn't going to happen. No one is so special and unique that we should tolerate whatever shit they want to spew indefinitely just for their unique perspective.

So regarding your argument, that we should stop banning people for being trolls or uncivil, that isn't going to happen.

This wasn't my argument and this attempted characterization of my argument doesn't engender any feeling in me that any further exchange would be productive

If HlynkaCG messaged the mods with a clear description of how he's not been engaging constructively recently and expressed an intent to not do that in the future, he'd probably be unbanned quickly. He's probably not going to do that though.

The only thing keeping us all here is both 1) that it's the best place to be and 2) that it's the only place to be. Not unlike America or Ancient Rome, even as it dives evermore into the shitter, it's still wrong to unperson someone because both of those things will remain true for the foreseeable future.

NTA but no one ever's probably going to do that, in this very thread (in other branches) people have clearly expressed their views on bending the knee and writing mea culpas to the janitors. I'm not keen on getting modded any time soon but I'm happy to join in the collective sentiment of "fuck that noise". It sounds like a good idea in the abstract but one mental test run of you yourself doing that should reliably dispel any notion of real-world applications.

I've seen it done on other forums, it's definitely cringe but it often works - just the ability to coherently articulate the mods' perspective on what the user was doing wrong is something most people who get banned for being annoying lack - and if it doesn't work the first time you just permaban them again.

Making an alt doesn't work well in the sense that it's liable to be detected, but it works fine in the sense that there is a venerable and proven record of it working for known / suspected / mods-openly-identify-person-as-alt-but-don't-take-action case. A reoccuring point from past mods when identified alts were raised in the past is that if someone Alts after being banned but isn't currently breaking the rules that got them banned, then their change in behavior is 'Mission Accomplished.'

Fair enough, but I doubt Hlynka will ever change his spots, so I strongly expect that if he was to return, he'd be back at it again, and his identity would be obvious.

There's a difference between having an alt, and having an alt after you were permabanned. Off memory, I can't recall an example of the latter that the mods knowingly condone, but it could well be true.

I agree that he wouldn't change his spots to passive-aggressive. He's too pugnacious to conform to the Motte's selection effect.

I agree, and I think if Hlynka returned on an alt and somehow avoided his worse habits he would probably be welcome, certainly in time, even if we all knew it was him.

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