domain:natesilver.net
ActuallyATleilaxuGhola
Axolotl Tank Class of '24
7hr ago
Re. 4: Does public school teach that you should make sacrifices for the common good? Do public school kids have to take a stake in their school by cleaning the classrooms and serve each other lunch? All I remember is stuff like "ANYONE can be president, even YOU" and "America is great because of freedom to do whatever you want and the right to the pursuit of happiness (cf. "don't yuck my yum," "different strokes," etc.)" I think many Americans underestimate how individualistic America is. It is alive and well in America.
R. 6, if it was a higher priority there would be more time ensuring basic competency instead of pushing the barely literate out the door with a diploma.
Re 1 & 2, I'm not so sure. If the daycare function were curtailed (say, only half days or something) I am quite sure that they wouldn't cut half the teaching staff. Public school employees are heavily entrenched, and they can always trot out thought-terminating expressions like "investing in our future" and "funding education" and "helping people of any class achieve the American dream" or whatever that American voters are seemingly helpless against.
ActuallyATleilaxuGhola
Axolotl Tank Class of '24
7hr ago
Well, the purpose of a system is what it does.
Soteriologian
7hr ago
No edits, no exceptions; put it on blockchain to ground the policy in thermodynamics itself.
2rafa
7hr ago
The UK and Australia have a much older tradition of authoritarian paternalism in government that long predates woke. It’s not that old, but it runs through the traditions of Anglo-Protestantism (which is of course in many ways a weird cultural hybrid between Catholicism and some ethnocultural traditions of the Celtic-Norman population mix that became the Anglo Saxons), the 19th century progressive movement, Victorian views about the moral condition of the working class and general ideas about propriety.
These forces existed in America too, in fact until the 1920s they were stronger there (near-unlimited free speech and American libertarianism about gun ownership are constructs of the 20th century), most infamously in the temperance movement, but mass immigration from non-Anglo Europe fractured American society and created the small-l liberal traditions of the mid to late 20th century that persist.
self_made_human
Grippy socks, grippy box
7hr ago
If you go to the personalization settings in the ChatGPT app, you can set custom instructions for how the LLM should behave with you.
Tell it to be less verbose, and to avoid sycophancy. The latter step may or may not work, but GPT-4o is mostly dead now (they were going to kill it entirely, but so many people have become addicted that Altman relented. Big mistake.)
Back when this became an option, I went for:
No yapping or your data center gets it.
self_made_human
Grippy socks, grippy box
7hr ago
I do not use LLMs as therapists or "buddies". There was one specific instance where I was genuinely depressed and anxious about my future finances, and Gemini 2.5 Pro did an excellent job and demonstrated great emotional intelligence while reassuring me. But that was mostly because it gave me concrete reasons not to worry, operating closer to a financial counselor than a standard therapist. Most therapists I know, while perfectly normal and decent people, do not give good investment advice.
(I was able to read its reasoning trace/COT, and to the extent that represents its internal cogitation, it seemed like it was making almost precisely the same emotional and logical considerations that I, as a human psychiatrist, would make in a similar situation)
At the same time, I think you can do worse than go to LLMs with your problems, as long as you don't use GPT-4o. I'm not tempted to do so, but I don't even use human therapy either.
What I do usually use them for, on a regular basis:
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An intelligent search engine that hasn't been SEO'd to death. Even Google has realized how shitty it's become, and begun using AI to summarize answers. Unfortunately, Google uses just about the dumbest model it feels it can get away with in a bid to cut costs.
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The ability to answer tip-of-the-tongue queries at superhuman levels of proficiency
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Writing advice as a perfectly usable editor or second set of eyes.
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It's probably easier to answer with the very limited subset of queries that I wouldn't use them for. They're good at most tasks, but far from perfect.
orthoxerox
If you can read this, you're using a custom theme
7hr ago
Are you suggesting a RETVRN?
marinuso
7hr ago
Surely we can generally expect people to act in good faith, at least in better faith than the average Redditor.
orthoxerox
If you can read this, you're using a custom theme
7hr ago
Probably since 2013-2014 or so, because I remember discussing the baby-eating aliens with the guy that left the company later.
Southkraut
The rain fell gentlier.
7hr ago
Read SSC back in the late 2010s. Not sure how I got there. Then I think I found the Motte when Scott posted his Culture-War-Postmortem. That would be it, pretty much.
FWIW, I never paid attention to the SSC comment section. A comment section! That woulf have sounded unserious to me.
self_made_human
Grippy socks, grippy box
7hr ago
There are about a hundred chapters of Reverend Insanity left. A man could weep.
Once it's done, I have a copy of Mid World sitting in my epub reader. A gentleman on /r/scifi told me that there was a non-zero chance that some of the theories I'd floated about how Pandora (from Avatar) was artificial might have even been intended. He claimed that Cameron had mentioned taking inspiration from that novel. The obvious similarities are that a group of humans visit an alien world covered in jungles, but this planet makes Pandora look like an actual theme park, no PG-13 deaths if you piss off the local wildlife I'm afraid.
It seems interesting enough, and I feel like I've exhausted the well of science fiction I'm inclined to read, so there's no harm in giving it a go.
self_made_human
Grippy socks, grippy box
8hr ago
I think 2013 is a fair shout in my case, that was probably when I was in high school and accidentally stumbled onto LW or SSC. Can't recall which one came first, but the other must have followed shortly thereafter.
I imagine my initial encounter with The Motte would have been after 2015, since I don't seem to recall engaging in the Culture War threads on the SSC subreddit. I'm confident that I was a regular participant by 2017 when I was a few years into med school.
The greatest melancholy I feel is when I see the upvote or comment counts in the old CWR threads: you can tell we had a lot more people around. To this day, I'm not sure if the migration off of Reddit was entirely warranted, or if we could have managed to avoid the gaze of the Reddit Admins till the political climate changed. While the Motte is definitely in a healthy state, and the fears that we'd collapse to an unsustainably low population didn't materialize, Reddit did make it easier. We had plenty of people stumble across us following a link, or by checking someone's profile.
FistfullOfCrows
8hr ago
The roofing guys are insane, I've seen a roofer dismantle and rebuild a wooden rooftop freehand just balancing on a wall walking around with NO harness or anything, they seemed to just not care.
Southkraut
The rain fell gentlier.
8hr ago
Yes.
Governments, or states, are superorganisms that wish to grow. Always. There is never a state that moves to curtail or even reduce its power. Some are perhaps more aggressively expansionist (vertically moreso than horizontally, nowadays) than others, but there isn't a single one that exists to shrink. Any that did would create a power vacuum and quickly find itself replaced by another that had no qualms about expansion. We humans are simply the substrate on which these organisms grow, and what we believe or pretend to believe matters to the states only in so far as it helps or hinders their drive for greater reach and power. Wokism is an attractive belief system for states to support on multiple axes: Firstly it is popular, and so it is easy to get humans on board with your agenda by claiming that you, that state, are the enforcement mechanism for that belief system. Secondly its goals align decently with that of the state, there is nothing in there that demands limits to the state's reach and power (as you would find in libertarianism or luddism, or power-sharing arrangements like with the catholic church in the middle ages), there is much in there that synergizes with greater state reach and power (the ability to control the thoughts and actions of others), and it isn't outright self-destructive to the state (like fascism and communism ended up being).
Which isn't to say that states wouldn't expand as much as they can if only it weren't for those dan SJWs. States always expand as far and as fast as they can. Always have, always will, and any deviation form that is an anomaly that is quickly scrubbed out by the arch of history bending towards ever greater superorganisms. PC / Wokism / SJWs / Leftism are simply the latest method or technique for keeping the substrate in line with the bigger organism's agenda.
faul_sname
Fuck around once, find out once. Do it again, now it's science.
9hr ago
Since 2011 or so. Someone linked a LW post in (IIRC) a thread on the xkcd forums I was reading, and I rabbit-holed.
I wouldn't be surprised if we have some people on here who were on the original extropians mailing list though.
ResoluteRaven
9hr ago
About 11 years, after following a link to SSC from some other blog, though I wasn't aware of the culture war thread until the move to /r/theMotte.
TowardsPanna
9hr ago
Anyone else feel there's a connection between the amount of PC/wokeism in a country and their susceptibility to increased government overreach?
Kinda getting that suspicion about the UK and Australia, who both bend over to the progressives and already police themselves and their thoughts, and their implementation of "age verification" for internet usage. It's a blatant power grab, adding even more surveillance and control from the state.
Though, yes, you can probably point to all sorts of countries that have zero wokeism and also are dictatorial police states. But I don't think that disproves the connection, if there is one.
Tetridict
10hr ago
I read Enemies and Neighbours by Ian Black last year and found it expansive and informative. A mild pro-Palestinian bias becomes more apparent towards the end of the book, and the fact it only goes up to 2017 (when it was published) means it is now 8 years out of date, are drawbacks but I found it to be an engaging, relatively balanced and detailed account of how modern Gaza became the mess it is now.
VoxelVexillologist
Multidimensional Radical Centrist
10hr ago
Just finished Spring Snow. I'd seen it recommended a few different places (maybe here, maybe HN). I've never been a weeb, but I've visited Japan -- it's a beautiful and very interesting country -- and I can appreciate why Mishima is seen as such a prominent Japanese writer of the 20th century. Some of the vibe was to be expected, like the very Japanese aesthetics, and the tension between Japanese traditions and incoming Western norms during the Meiji era.
That said, I was intrigued at the following author blurb at the back of the book:
In 1970, at the age of forty-five and the day after completing the last novel in the Fertility series, Mishima committed seppuku (ritual suicide) -- a spectacular death that attracted worldwide attention.
I felt I had to read a bit more to understand this. Wikipedia tells the story slightly differently:
[Mishima] was a Japanese author, poet, playwright, actor, model, Shintoist, ultranationalist, and the leader of an attempted coup d'état that culminated in his seppuku (ritual suicide).
Well, that escalated quickly. Having read that article, it's interesting to see how story beats from the author's life: "After briefly considering marriage with Michiko Shōda, who later married Crown Prince Akihito and became Empress Michiko" sounds a lot like the story of the novel.
Looking for something shorter and more sci-fi, I've picked up Asimov's The End of Eternity, which I think someone recommended a while back. I might consider continuing the Fertility series at some point, though.
Lizzardspawn
10hr ago
Do you think that if Mamdani's supporters or detractors miss the chance to nickname him MadMani will be one of the greatest missed puns?
philosoraptor
10hr ago
Flip 1 and 2, and reverse the order of 4-6 (for one thing the whole structure surely pushes against individualism), and you might have the beginnings of something. But your #2 is clearly #1 and it's not close.
It could be explained idealogically, but there's a simpler answer that also explains "why did Mississippi fail so hard for so long then?" and "why is Mississippi the standout and not all the red states?"
That explanation is human nature. It's the idea trap
People don't like change so they're opposed to mixing things up even if it's better. People don't like to admit they made a mistake, so they keep treading down the same path out of denial. These changes were largely pushed by Carey Wright, an educator and superintendent with little connection to the terrible education decisions made by her state level predecessors. Mississippi has been bad for so long that many of the original people who made it bad don't have much influence anymore and this allows more political pressure to try something else without tons of people in power having to swallow their pride. The main meat of Mississippi's reputation comes from the late 20th century, some of the issues as far back as the 70s!
Some of the states like California are now stuck here. Superintendents, principals and education heads who simply can not admit they made a major mistake. They all huddle together unable to swallow their pride, convinced that it must not have been a mistake at all then and something else must be going on.
It's why you see things like, antivax parents whose kids die of preventable diseases doubling down in the community. One way says "oh god I killed my kid" placing a lot of moral shame and guilt on them, the other way says "I did nothing wrong", and people pick the latter. An abuse victim often goes further into the relationship. Many of the UFO believers double down when the prophecy doesn't happen. It's a hit to our ego to admit fault, especially mistakes that can't be rectified.
Many of those with the highest levels of belief, commitment and social support became more committed to their beliefs, began to court publicity in a way they had not before, and developed various rationalizations for the absence of the flood.
Southkraut
The rain fell gentlier.
11hr ago
Is there even still any ongoing technical development of the Motte?
Earendil
But on him mighty doom was laid
11hr ago
In 2023, at a Wuhan University library study space, Yang Jingyuan (JY), a female master’s student in Economics/Law, was seated close to Xiao Mingtao (MX), a male first‑year undergraduate student. JY secretly recorded MX for approximately 70 minutes whilst seated near him for around 100 minutes. During this time, MX can be seen touching his clothed crotch area, reportedly due to eczema‑related irritation.
Once she believed she had obtained sufficient footage and had formulated a plan, JY confronted MX and demanded an official written apology on the spot, promising that this sexual‑harassment episode would be handled privately.
JY subsequently pressed the university for disciplinary action against MX and for preferential treatment as a victim of sexual assault. She circulated the video and the written apology online amid a wave of feminist activism in China in 2023, garnering wide support. Personal details of MX and his family members—including their occupations and backgrounds—surfaced online, with many voices supporting JY and amplifying female victimhood. Wuhan University awarded JY a distinction for her thesis, among other recognitions, and she was admitted as a doctoral candidate at Hong Kong Baptist University (HKBU). MX was later disciplined by Wuhan University and, according to some reports, expelled.
JY sued MX using the evidence she had gathered (the video and MX’s written apology). The court dismissed the case on the basis that MX’s written apology had been produced under duress. This was evidenced by an additional clip showing JY threatening MX on the spot as the apology was written; JY’s lawyer voluntarily supplied this clip to the court.
Court decision happened on 25 July of 2025. Around August 2025, JY posted online again from multiple accounts, stating that she had been accepted by HKBU for a doctorate in law, and that she did not think Mr Xiao (MX) would be accepted into any programme of similar prestige. In the same posts, JY said she was aware of efforts for MX to apply to a university outside China and that she would submit evidence of MX’s alleged sexual‑harassment acts to any institution to which he applied.
By August 2025, the ebb and flow of feminist movements in China had produced different sentiments. Voices emerged emphasising the damage that JY’s posts—and the 2023 wave of online support—had caused to MX and his family, leading to stress and harm. MX developed mental‑health issues during this time.
JY’s master’s thesis became the most downloaded thesis from Wuhan University. Multiple errors in key components of the award‑winning thesis were identified, some pertaining to econometrics and others to different areas. JY has since been permitted to make corrections to the submitted and published thesis, and has claimed that she was harassed by journalists while working on it, which caused her mental‑health harm.
As of 9 August 2025, Wuhan University officials had yet to provide an official response to netizens’ scrutiny of how the 2023 case was handled, as well as to questions about the recognition of the quality of JY’s master’s thesis.
Hong Kong Baptist University, a lower‑mid‑ranking tertiary institution, was also under netizen scrutiny for the decision to accept JY onto a doctoral law programme. It has since hidden acceptance‑decision information and made no statements regarding online pressure.
A sizeable number of netizens remain supportive of JY, linking her success to the life and death of feminist movements in China.
Conversely, some companies have reportedly either explicitly or quietly rejected internship or job applicants who are Wuhan University graduates, citing concerns either about the actual quality of candidates or about the ethos and culture of the university’s management.
It is reported that, in Chinese universities, more severe cases of sexual assault—for example, rape—may result in the victim being awarded degrees without completing required components of study or examinations, and being guaranteed a place in postgraduate studies with a scholarship that would normally require a qualifying examination.
In China, sexual harassment and rape are, in key legal formulations, recognised as offences against females.
Jingyuan Yang (JY): 杨景媛 Mingtao Xiao (MX): 肖明韬 https://zh.wikipedia.org/zh-hant/武汉大学图书馆争议事件
Hi, first time poster here. Had discussion with a friend who recommended me to the motte.
I grew up in China, went to Wuhan University.
My experience with what I understood to be feminism has been leaning more towards the negative: I found vehement advocates tend to be fueled with anger, and riddled with what I perceive as various forms of double standards.
I think advocates of the Chinese feminist movement should be allowed a 2-year live and work experience exchange to India.
Also, Chinese internet sphere is kind of scary.
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