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Primaprimaprima
Aliquid stat pro aliquo
1hr ago
Out in the world, life continues.
...but not for Charlie Kirk.
"Just don't worry about it lol" is a really tone deaf response right now.
professorgerm
You shall love your crooked neighbor, with your crooked heart
1hr ago
No, I have no sympathy for those people and no sympathy for the concept of celebrating a death. Publicly. Like some soulless amoral ghoul.
There are people I hate, politicians and intellectuals that I think are strongly net-negative for the world. To be clear, I would not mourn them, were they struck by lightning or fed to sharks. But neither would I celebrate, it wouldn’t cross my mind. Especially not publicly. At most, a passing thought that thank goodness such tragedy didn’t happen to a decent person, but I’ve got enough of a heart to keep that to myself.
Dean
Flairless
1hr ago
Control over framing is truly one of the most important parts of narrative building. In the same sense that any metaphor can break down if examined too closely, being able to set initial scopes of conversation- and refuse/refute attempts to reshape it- is an almost necessary skill in any sort of competitive/contested narrative environment.
Learning how to handle it subtly / gracefully / reasonably is another important skill, since 'I'm just going to ignore what you said and repeat my point' tends to go down badly, but framing devices ranging from timeframe and cultural contexts are significant.
professorgerm
You shall love your crooked neighbor, with your crooked heart
1hr ago
Still a process as punishment situation if the university wants to risk it.
Ward Churchill is one of the most infamous for calling the 9/11 victims Eichmanns, he got no payout and didn’t get his job back. Some teachers and professors fired for things like deadnaming did, eventually, get a payout or their job back. The climate is certainly different now than it was then, but I wouldn’t want to be a university employee floating a test case in it either.
The remedy is to take a break from going to social media sites where people who sit online 18 hours a day fling shit at each other, and to take a break from hanging out with ideologues in real life, and to go interact with people in general.
Out in the world, life continues. The birds are singing, the flowers are blooming. The majority of people are not paying attention to this stuff.
You are reacting the way that many people reacted when they heard that JFK was assassinated, or that MLK was assassinated. An emotional shock. But the rational response, I think, is to remember that assassinations are really really rare. There is no actual civil war going on. Well, there's a cold civil war going on, but not a hot one.
Why is that the case?
It's because of law and order. Which, for all of the current system's faults, and I sure would love it to do a better job of taking care of ordinary people like me instead of exposing me to random street violence and so on, is doing a good job of dissuading that subset of the left who would love to kill right-wingers and that subset of the right who would love to kill left-wingers from actually doing it.
Liberalism, for now, is holding. I mean classical liberalism, not the weird American "liberals = the left" definition.
Yes, there are plenty of angry people in this country who would love to assassinate the leaders of their political opponents, or maybe even put their political opponents in mass into extermination camps.
But liberalism, for now, is holding. As a centrist moderate, I sure hope that it continues to hold. There are some good reasons to believe that it will continue to hold. For one, I think that probably the majority of rich people have no use for a civil war full of populists who are ready to murder anyone who is more successful than them and can be painted as being on the other side.
Given how many guns are in private hands in the US and how many politically angry people there are, assassinations are actually surprisingly rare.
People almost never get killed for their political opinions in the US. It happens very rarely. Now, people do get frequently killed because of political policies in general... and that's one area where I sympathize with the right, despite disagreeing with them on most things. What I mean specifically is, pathological empathy-driven progressive policies that end up unleashing street criminals on the public. That's something I disagree with progressives on.
But the murder of someone like Charlie Kirk is an easily foreseeable consequence of what happens when you have hundreds of millions of guns in private hands in a country that is politically polarized.
Note, when I say that I am not calling for gun ownership rights to be reduced. I'm just saying that statistically, it's an obvious consequence. These things are inevitably going to happen from time to time. It's surprising that they happen so infrequently.
Social media is currently awash with people who are using this incident to get cheap dopamine hits and/or to propagandize for their side of the great chimp shit-flinging fight that is the culture war.
They're deranged. And they should not be taken seriously. Most of them are sad people who are using political engagement to make up for the failures of their individual lives.
Someone who is highly politically engaged and spends 18 hours a day writing angry comments on social media will end up creating more online political content than 100 ordinary people. Social media enormously over-represents the opinions of angry no-life losers on both sides of the culture war.
Some view it all as a war between good and evil. And, if I was in some part of Mexico where people fought against murderous cartels, I'd see it that way too. But I live in the US. I am lucky enough, because of the continuing success (for all their faults) of the US' liberal systems and norms, to be able to see our situation in the US as a war between the stupid and the smart. A delineation that cuts across left/right lines.
As in the famous Revenge of the Sith crawl, "there are heroes on both sides"... well, in our reality it's not quite that epic, it's more like "there are smart and stupid people on both sides". And "there are decent people and sociopaths on both sides". I'm lucky to live in a part of the world where that's actually the case. But it is the case.
ThisIsSin
PC is for progressive-conservative
1hr ago
You make left-wingers sound like retarded children who can't grasp the basics of cause and effect.
That's the mistake theory explanation, yes. People think this because the conflict theory explanation- where when pressed, they pretend it's a game, then pretend they weren't serious, then attempt to remind you their inherent moral worth deserves your leniency, then make it clear they know exactly what they're doing and proceed with the destructive thing anyway- is just not something humans have evolved to deal with.
We don't accept explanations of just following orders "actually, I'm just retarded" from the right[0] for deep-seated biological reasons. That we accept them from the left[1] (also for deep-seated biological reasons) is actually a big deal.
"Oh, no! She's going to be insufferable after this. She's going to ride the sympathy and milk it for the next 50 years. She might get to be president now. This is a disaster."
Not that "involuntarily attending a school shooting" isn't a viable way to political power (David Hogg), but I very much doubt that if you get shot like Kirk was, you'll be enjoying anything after that (much less political power).
[0, 1] For rightists, being retarded is never believed because, as human doings [or in modern times, people more aligned with human doings], it's strictly an evolutionary malus (stupidity is a detriment to executing your will) so any assertions you were retarded accidentally are naturally looked upon with extreme skepticism. For leftists it's always believed because, as human beings [or in modern times, people more aligned with human beings], being able to convince human doings to take pity on you while manipulating them when their back is turned is an evolutionary bonus (feigning childishness is an enhancement).
philosoraptor
1hr ago
But I, like Kirk, was in an environment where I was never going to run a serious risk of being ostracized.
Are you seriously trying to suggest, at this of all times, that he wasn't running any risks?
ABigGuy4U
1hr ago
It reminds me of the disappearance of Jean McConville, or some of the other similarly sickening incidents of the Troubles. The attitude was there too. Stopping your car to jeer at a soldier as he bleeds to death on the road. I think about Northern Ireland a lot lately.
WandererintheWilderness
1hr ago
As corny as it sounds, appealing to people's better nature, taking the moral high ground. Don't go on the attack trying to look for ulterior motives and ideology behind the cheering - just call out the cheering as unkind and inhuman at the rawest level. The approach should be to shame people into self-reflection within their own consciences. "This? This is what you want? This is righteous? Are you sure? I don't believe that. I don't believe that deep down, you or anyone decent can believe that. We wouldn't wish it on you or anyone on your side. Truly we wouldn't. Please don't darken your own hearts by going down that road." Above all else keep the clip in circulation, with all its visceral, disquieting pathos. The idea that Charlie Kirk Is Dead can be thoughtlessly celebrated, but the actual sight of it - no, not unless you're a sociopath.
SubstantialFrivolity
I'm not even supposed to be here today
1hr ago
I just picked up a couple of games on the recommendation of people I work with: Hell Is Us and TMNT: Shredder's Revenge. TMNT is great, albeit pretty challenging (the third level is a huge difficulty spike and I got frustrated enough that I haven't played since). But difficulty aside it's exactly what you would want from a modern take on the TMNT arcade game of old. They added a decent bit more depth to the combat and a ton more characters to play (Splinter, April, Casey Jones, etc), plus the pixel art is beautiful.
Hell Is Us is... yeah IDK yet. My colleague pitched it to me as having a lot in common with the puzzle solving in Tomb Raider, but it doesn't quite feel to me like it has that vibe. There is puzzle solving, but so far the most prominent element has been the combat and the creepy supernatural horror atmosphere the monsters add. The basic premise is that your character is trying to navigate a world torn apart by religious civil war and see his parents, when he runs into the otherworldly monsters and... that's about it so far. I'm only 2 hours in, and the storytelling is very sparse. They seem to be going for a minimalist Souls approach to storytelling, which is very much not my jam. The game is also very proud to not have any sort of navigational aids - no markers, no map, just a compass you can consult to see which direction you're going. I can understand why they do that, but that is also not really my jam (in particular the lack of map, which I do not like at all). But all the same, I've been warming to it slowly and we'll see how it goes.
Though both of those games are getting set aside in a week, when Trails in the Sky 1st comes out. If you're unfamiliar with Trails, it's a moderately well known, long running JRPG series (like 12 or 13 games at this point) which is known for all the games having an interconnected plot. They have their smaller arcs so you can just play one arc without going balls deep, but it is kind of special to play since the very first game and see returning characters and plot threads from that far back. It's also unashamedly traditional JRPG fare, and it's become my Final Fantasy replacement for that reason (because FF is too busy trying to appeal to new audiences to bother making games their long time fans enjoy, and yes I'm bitter). Anyways, this game is a remake of the very first game in the series, and by the demo it looks to be a very faithful remake (exactly how I like them). So I'm looking forward to that one a lot, and all other games are going to get dropped when that comes out.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
1hr ago
have you tried Beware of Chicken? My wife and I love it.
The_Nybbler
If you win the rat race you're still a rat. But you're also still a winner.
1hr ago
Look at that graph. TFR drops from 1800 until 1940 (with the 1935 to 1940 drop being smaller by far than the 1930 to 1935 drop), then goes SHARPLY back up until 1960, falls again as sharply until 1980, then goes slightly back up and down. There is absolutely no evidence for your position; you've got less than nothing.
The_Nybbler
If you win the rat race you're still a rat. But you're also still a winner.
1hr ago
Yeah, it's not an ambush at all. He invited them to attack his prepared position, that's not an ambush.
ThomasdelVasto
Κύριε, ποίησόν με ὄργανον τῆς ἀγάπης σου
1hr ago
What are the best completed cultivation novels in your mind? I started reverend insanity off the rec of @self_made_human but wasn’t feeling the evil MC vibe.
I’ve read coiling dragon, I shall seal the heavens, cradle, and mother of learning and liked em all. Tried out Warlock of magus world but it’s a little too silly for me so far.
Any thoughts?
philosoraptor
1hr ago
That's not a debate, that's an ambush.
In what other ambush scenario does the side that's supposedly being ambushed get to decide whether, how, and when to engage?
Bleep
1hr ago
Israelis generally likely wouldn't, but Netanyahu and co use Hamas as a justification (especially to their domestic opposition) to refuse to negotiate in good faith let alone negotiate a longer-term political solution to the conflict, e.g., a two state solution which is the preferred and endorsed "solution" by the overwhelming vast majority of the world for many decades and, at the time, a sizeable portion of Israelis. Netanyahu and co can claim they have no "viable partner for peace" as long as Hamas is in control.
It's important to remember, Netanyahu and co very nearly lost that battle when Yitzhak Rabin was elected PM in 1992 on making peace and who genuinely engaged in dialogue with the Palestinians to work towards a lasting peaceful political solution with the Oslo Accords and Peace Process. Or he was until he was assassinated.
Additionally, Netanyahu and co think of Hamas as not being particularly dangerous; Israel would simply need to go in and "mow the grass" from time to time to keep them beaten down.
So they constantly serve as a placeholder who murder any upstart rivals and prevent a more palatable (to negotiate with) group coming to the front in the Gaza strip as well as prevent a united group across the Strip and the West Bank.
lurker
1hr ago
I've asked for evidence of being a groyper from people saying it and usually they just stop talking at that point. Only one guy actually gave any reason at all and it was that no true leftist would write any of that on the bullet casings and it's obviously a right winger false flagging. Suffice it to say this reasoning is utterly unconvincing.
Iconochasm
2. Bootstrap the rest of the fucking omnipotence.
2hr ago
Iconochasm
2. Bootstrap the rest of the fucking omnipotence.
2hr ago
If you want to understand Donald Trump, imagine your normie grandfather having a power fantasy about being the super-model banging billionaire who saves America with Common Sense and Not Being A Loser.
chooky
2hr ago
Silksong, from what I can tell, seems to be explicitly designed to avoid much of the power creep of other metroidvanias, including Hollow Knight, hence the paucity of damage and health upgrades. But it may be that I am very dumb - I got through almost all of Hollow Knight before realizing that the nail upgrades even existed. (I do have the first needle upgrade in SS; getting the second seems like it requires quite a bit beyond merely beating Act I, which I have done.)
Iconochasm
2. Bootstrap the rest of the fucking omnipotence.
2hr ago
Have you actually seen anything specifying "neonazi"? Everything I saw in the news had just a generic statement about "an extremist group" and "still unclear about the motive".
Soteriologian
2hr ago
It takes time for deep incentive changes of this sort to percolate. It wasn’t intended as a subsidy for childlessness, nor was it perceived as such.
But it nonetheless is.
It sounds sort of like you want to slot this into something like trolling or outrage bait? I don't think I agree with that if so. Yes I don't care that he's dead. I love that he's dead. He was evil! That my enemies are incorrectly modeling my behavior and, were they only to change how they treated me, sounds like something that I would want to believe if I knew my participation in an activity was irresponsible or unjustified. Passing this responsibility onto others, especially onto my enemy, sounds ideal. You made me do it is tried and true.
because it has a significant risk of Streisanding the idea of actively supporting assassinations among people who currently don't support them
Personally, I think this is already out of the bag, among all manner of other things that make one a leftist, fascist, good, or bad. The left-coding isn't for the benefit of or in response to the right. The left-coding is and -- rather than something new -- we should consider this a resurgence of an old meme the left has relied on and used to great effect before. I suppose the right could try a 4D play and reclaim calls to violence (doesn't go well for them) or attempt its own social media-gov't speech restriction on behalf of conservatives which also doesn't go well.
I agree nobody should want to will something like this into existence or exacerbate it. A vicious, more violent left benefits some. What appropriate response do you have in mind?
I just posted a comment recommending Cradle. Good job me. Since you've already read Cradle, I agree with FC that Beware of Chicken is extremely funny.
As for another... I enjoyed listening to an AI audiobook of Release That Witch, despite an embarrassing pseudo-harem element. It's an isekai where a chemist bootstraps an industrial revolution in a magical setting; the "progression" is more Civilization than Amazing Cultivation Simulator though.
Very interesting how Communist theory seeped into the Chinese author's depiction of a state planned economy.
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