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Top Administration Officials Are Now Openly Admitting That America Is Israel's Bitch.
This wasn't clipped and quoted from a fringe groyper. This was posted by an official White House account.
I can't believe this shit. The United States has abdicated strategic initiative to Israel. The American armed forces in the Middle East have been reduced to reacting to and mitigating damage from Israel's operations in the theater. The straightforward interpretation of the above quote is that Israel started a war that killed American troops.
I was watching Tucker Carlson lay out this exact theory and thought, “well that’s an interesting idea. Too bad we’ll never know for sure.” And then the first thing I see when I tab over to Twitter is Marco Rubio making the exact same thought.
If Republicans are going to be Israelis bitch can the Jews decide that they will play on my side in domestic politics?
I will take the deal gladly. ADL comes out and says white lives matter. Open borders are stupid. Advocate for deporting 200k Somlians. Kagan writes some eloquent opinion that birth right citizenship is obviously false.
I’m fine with shipping $200 billion in bombs to Israel if the bulk of Jewish intellect plays on my team. We can motte and bailey all day long on whether “Jews run the world” or they just “play way above their size” because they’re smart. My big issue with Jews is the bulk of their community seems to have played a game that is against my interests.
The left is too infiltrated with third-worldism for their old political arrangements to work out. If you want MAGA support then I want to see Jewish money going 80% to MAGA and the Jewish vote being 80% MAGA. I feel like these are reasonable terms.
The obvious hypothesis would be that Jews are not, in fact, a hivemind capable of making deals collectively.
Israel can do what it wants, but it actually doesn’t control the ADL or random donors. And the Republican Party has spent long enough pissing those individuals off that it can’t expect a sudden reversal.
I suppose I also think it’s wrong to describe “the left” as a monolith for similar reasons.
Then I wouldn’t back bombing Iran if they can’t give us that. Iran is not very important to the US. It is to Israel. No reason to help Israel if they can’t return a favor.
Practicing Catholics vote 80%+ GOP. Maybe it’s even 95% for regular attendees. For decades we’ve been told we can only vote Republican. Either Israel can deliver that or they can not.
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If you want to talk in practical terms, now is the unique moment that this can happen. American Jews had been traditionally Democrat voters. And when Democrats were just the socialist-curious wing of Uniparty, that worked pretty well for them. Once the woke left declared their alliance with Islam and went full-in on their program of destroying the Western civilization, that stopped working. American Jews, of course, as any multi-million population, are not homogenous. But most of them would be fine with a little socialism here and there, and maybe a little social progressivism, and with what Democratic party offered in 1980s-1990s. But a lot of them are not OK with the cult of Hamas and the antisemitic frenzy embraced by the woke left. Harris lost almost a million of Jewish votes compared to previous elections. There's certainly some potential for more gains here.
So what some of the geniuses on the right do now? Of course they hastily organize their own antisemitic wing so that the left antisemites do not have a corner on that market. They blame Israel for everything that goes wrong in the foreign policy, and blame Jews for everything that goes wrong in the domestic policy. They unearth every blood libel that can be discovered, and invent some new ones just for fun. They say radical Islam is not so bad, because see, they hate Jews and gays, just like we do. They declare every Jew in US politics their enemy, no matter how many common goals there could be between them. Is this a smart way to build a coalition? Is this the way to convince the Jews who never thought about voting anything but Democrat, but now thinking maybe it's worth considering, to switch? Is this how you build the team?
I think it'd be very smart and very beneficial for America to build a team like that. But there are a lot of people right now on the right that work very hard to make it impossible. I hope they fail, but I can not be sure of that, unfortunately.
That could happen. I'd like to see that happen. But for this to happen, Qatarlson, Owens and their ilk can not be part of the deal. Right now, the towering stature of Trump makes them tiny and irrelevant. But Trump will be gone from power, at least officially, in 2028, and it is not at all clear he would be able to exert any power on the movement, and have enough clout to say who's in and who's out. And Vance, who is the presumed heir, still sitting on the fence there. And if the groypers remain in, and have the influence on the movement, the Jews will not be voting for MAGA, not 80% and not even the majority. Some committed conservatives could pinch their nose and still go with it, but it won't even get to Trump numbers, let alone exceed them. Why would one vote for a movement that literally considers you a demonic entity that must be eliminated?
The problem is the Jews did do a lot of the things the right accuses them of. We are just the big party that can be transactional.
Israel and their backers did run a blood libel against white identity using the holocausts as justification. And they did a very good job of it. The ADL was the primary Jewish interest group and they’ve been promoting the blood libel for decades. I can understand how they thought that was in their best interests but today we need a new deal.
Like what specifically? I mean, of course there are Jews that did any particular shit. There are Jewish thieves, Jewish rapists, Jewish murderers, Jewish terrorists, Jewish gangsters, Jewish anything you like. There are a lot of Jews, a lot of them are very smart, and if one also happens also to be a psychopath, you'll get yourself a very prominent criminal or a communist leader or something like that. But I'd like to figure out, what exactly is the problem about which we're talking here.
That's not true. Israel had never been an active participant in US culture wars. Especially not in the Great Awokening, which had been thoroughly infested with violent hate for Israel. It is true that some of the Jewish organizations - like ADL - shamefully, used the Holocaust as justification for their left-wing propaganda, but Israel had nothing to do with it, and most of the Jews neither endorsed it nor had any influence on the matter. ADL is not some kind of Jewish representative, it is just a bunch of grifters whose grift happens to be in being Jews and serving Democrats. Other Jews can't really do much about it.
No it wasn't, and it certainly isn't. They were a bunch of loudmouths who were somewhat listened to because they weren't obviously corrupt, and now that it's obvious they are, they are about as representative as Naturei Karta. One can say they are "a" Jewish group, that's true, but nowhere even near "the primary" Jewish group, especially once they sold their soul to the woke. That is not exclusively Jewish phenomenon - organizations like ACLU, EFF, Greenpeece, and many others suffered the same fate, once they were maybe a left-leaning, but fundamentally sound organizations with a cause, which can be agreed or disagreed, but there was a proper cause, one which people could talk about without buying into the whole woke package. Now they are just skinsuits that the woke left wears when it's tactically convenient. ADL now happens to be a Jewish woke skinsuit, but that's where its connection with the Jewishness ends.
And if you want to make practical gains in luring Jews into MAGA, you message should not be "ADL are Jews, therefore all Jews are the same and as bad as the worst of ADL". That's just doing the same shit the left is doing to you. And I mean it can feel good, but does it work? Did it work on you when they called you a Nazi? Did you think "oh gosh, the Left called me a Nazi, I must rethink everything and change!" or did you think "fuck that noise, I am not listening to them anymore!"? If you want to do better, your message should be "ADL are Jews, but they are bad and lost the right to represent Jews in any way. Come here, my fellow Jews, let's unite under our umbrella of common sense and reject the bullshit ADL is peddling you!".
Denying the ADL after they are no longer useful. That’s like the CIA denying a spy after the fucked up. Of course you deny it now.
“The best funded Jewish group who were hardcore zionists - wasn’t us”
Whether Israel directly worked with them in messaging is a tough question. But Israel could have shut them down at any time. They are zionists. That’s like a the pope calling me and telling me I can’t do something anymore. I have to listen.
Nobody is "denying" anything. You are trying to pre-suppose you are correct and your opponents' arguments are illegitimate, this is not something that you get for free just because you want it. I described you in detail what is the deal with ADL - it was one thing, now it's a different thing. Things change. If you think what I described is not true, please address it on substance, not just resort to name calling.
No, it's not like that at all - nobody is "denying" ADL are Jews, and nobody is "denying" they fucked up.
I am not sure who you are quoting, so I am not sure I need to address that, unless you explain what do you mean.
No, it's not tough at all. It didn't. Israel has its own messaging, and the interest in participating in US culture wars in Israel is pretty much none. Israel has its own troubles. It is true that Israel values US as an ally greatly, and will do a lot to help keep US as an ally and keep the positive relations between US and Israel. But there are much better venues for that and ADL does not play a major role in it, especially the woke part of ADL.
No, it could not - Israel does not finance it and has no operational control over it. And, frankly, why would Israel shut down political activities of US citizens on US soil? Yes, they are zionists - but being zionist is not some chip that you install in your head that puts you under control of the Israeli government. Being zionists just means you don't think Israel must be destroyed. It's a pretty low bar - it is absolutely fascinating, to be honest, you even need a word for it. There's no word to call people that think Japan does not need to be destroyed. There's no word for people that think Morocco is a legitimate state that should exist. Pretty much any country on the face of Earth - sure, there might be people that want to destroy this country, haters gonna hate. But only for Israel there's a special word for people that don't think genocide is a good idea. For all other countries, these people are called "normal people". Such is the sad reality to which we are used. So yes, there are zionists. So what?
No, it's not like that at all. First of all, Jews don't have a pope and never did. Even within Judaism, even within the most Orthodox of the Ortodox Judaism (which in the minority of Jews) there's no such concept - if you bother to study about it, Judaism had always been a pluralistic religion, and propagation of the religious law could not be more dissimilar to what Catholics have. There literally can not be an analogue to Pope in Judaism (except for Moses once and the Messiah when he comes, of course, but beyond that, none). I am not saying this to say Catholics are wrong, just in Judaism things work very differently, that's a fact.
Second, of course, not all Jews are religious or Israeli or agree to what any particular Israeli government is doing (that's an understatement like saying when the bomb explodes not all the parts stay perfectly still in the same place). ADL has neither religious nor any other obligation to listen to anything anybody in Israel says, whether in power or not. Sure, they could cooperate with Israel when they think it makes sense for them - and they do. But voluntary cooperation and total control that you are implying are very different thing. They don't have to listen to anything. They may decide to listen, or may decide to ignore.
Now, the important part here - if you are still reading - going back to what started the conversation. If you want to get more Jews to be part of the MAGA movement - which I think is a good goal, as there is a lot of intersection between what most of the American Jews want and what most of the MAGA people want - then picking up how ADL hurt you and how much Israel is at fault for that is a useless activity. I mean, it may be attractive for you, but it is useless for reaching that goal. If you want to get more Jews voting for MAGA, then chanting "you are shit because ADL is shit and you are responsible for it!" is not going to do that. We can agree ADL has become shit. You can convince more and more Jews to stop listening to ADL on this basis - because nobody likes listening to shit, so if you can convince people ADL is a shitty organization now, you can get them to stop. But if you insist that ADL is the same as Jews and Israel, and forever has been, and forever will be - they you don't leave any common platform to stand on. How then would you enable the future cooperation?
Historical intelligence and sharing allegations: In the early 1990s, a major controversy arose when San Francisco police raided ADL offices, uncovering evidence of extensive spying on thousands of activists, organizations (including Arab-American groups, anti-apartheid activists, and others critical of Israel), and individuals. Court documents and reports indicated that some of this information was shared with Israeli government officials and intelligence agencies (including Mossad). The ADL settled related lawsuits without admitting wrongdoing, but sources like The Nation, MERIP, and others described it as part of close ties where the ADL provided data to Israel (and sometimes the U.S. State Department or FBI) on critics of Israeli policy.
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This is more or less meaningless word salad.
Come on Israel thru their proxies like the ADL have actively been trying to destroy white identities for decades. It’s not a word salad. And factually it’s like true. You can just read the ADL website.
It’s verifiable they did the thing. And that side had a complete victory for most of my adult life.
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Despite the claims of our swastika-enjoying members, American Jews aren't a monolith. The ADL is more likely to support Hamas than MAGA no matter what, but Jared Kushner isn't the same. Nor are the Haredim, though they're a problem for other reasons. During the last election we saw a few prominent Jews peeled off the "ADL" side by the antics of universities, and possibly we'll see more of that, but I don't expect the bulk of American Jews to abandon leftism any time soon. Though if some Democrat does go full Hamas, more of them may hold their nose and vote your way in a specific election.
There is a reason I said I wanted them 80-20 MAGA. It’s not a monolith. But they’ve been close to 80-20 against for a long time.
The pro-life movement vote 95-5 with MAGA. In many ways GOP is not a natural place for Roman Catholics. Most of the Catholic (European variety) have always voted for big welfare state. So yes if you want MAGA bombs you better give us the votes and figure out how to make friends. This is how politics work.
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Maybe Jews as a group have too many ancestral memories in their culture to ever end up giving 80% of their money to something like MAGA, at least for the foreseeable future. For them, MAGA has too many unpleasant connotations of past cultures that were violent toward Jews.
On a side note, I think that while Jews lean left in American politics, they also happen to be over-represented relative to their population size in American right-wing politics. Unsurprisingly if one believes in the hypothesis that they are influential mainly because of high intelligence, they're basically over-represented relative to their population size in every political movement that does not deliberately exclude Jews.
What makes MAGA different from the causes they're actually supporting, like infinity Muslim immigration, or the Blue Tribe in general?
I mean, you can watch the same guy wishing for this deal turn around and accuse Jews of running their own blood libel. I could see how that would be a deal-breaker.
Yeah, but that "same guy" is as MAGA as he is Jewish, I wager.
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Is there evidence that they actually support infinity Muslim immigration, as opposed to just enough of any immigration that no ethnic group gets the strength to advance its own interests by virtue of numbers? Do they encourage further Muslim immigration to countries that are majority or nearly majority Muslim, like Lebanon, Bosnia-Herzegovina, Albania or Indonesia?
(Maybe you could argue that (((they))) islamised Syria, but that was more about Russia. Weaponising Muslims against Russians seems like more of a gentile Anglo civilisational project to me.)
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Quasi-ethnic majoritarian nationalism with strong but unadhered to Christian themes has… not tended to be a good bargain for Jews in the past.
I think it’s fair to say every group hates the Jews. Being a minority group that ends up with more people at the top and does have some of their own independent desires is just not a good place to be. It’s the same thing in S Africa with the 10% white population. The 90% black population will end up singing “kill the boer” when the 10% control everything.
A multicultural society of third worlders will mostly end up hating the Jews too. As we have seen.
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That hardly explains why they'd prefer infinity Muslims, or the Blue tribe.
The blue tribe has generally been good to Jews, does that need much explaining? Imperial centralizing scholar-bureaucrats usually are.
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The Blue tribe is the Jews. To be more precise, the Blue Tribe is the Anglo-Jewish culture that appears when not-Orthodox PMC Jews and PMC WASPS start working at the same banks/law firms etc. and joining the same golf clubs.
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Blue tribe doesn't have the connotations of "stupid angry white hicks who will come to our village and pogrom us".
The Muslim immigration doesn't seem like a viscerally real, tangible problem because so far it has only built up to small minorities in Western countries.
This seems obviously false now. We have seen the brown people march and chant “from the river to the sea” now.
Maybe 5-10 years ago it was not viscerally real. Today the visceral reality seems very real. Team third worlders if they had enough political power to pogrom Jews seem fine with it.
We have seen it. The average Jew is not a politics-obsessed person who watches the latest aggregated videos of demonstrations on social media and automatically distrusts mainstream framings of topics.
Jews don’t watch the news seems like a poor argument to me. Compared to the average American even adjusted for education they donate more to politics, volunteer more in politics, and spend more time on message boards. They are literally the most politically engaged group in America.
Blacks are the most "being an NBA player"-engaged ethnic group in America, yet the vast majority of blacks are not NBA players.
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How so? They're the ones doing all the "antisemitic" protests that they were complaining so much about.
Then why were they complaining so much about all the people celebrating October 7th?
It's all propaganda. In reality, anti-semitism in America was historically not a Red Tribe phenomenon. Anti-semitism in America wasn't pograms, it was stuff like Harvard's Jewish quotas, country clubs refusing Jews, that sort of thing. There was the Klan, who hated almost everyone, but Jews weren't their main focus. There's also black anti-Semitism and Muslim anti-Semitism -- the latter is basically imported and the former fairly recent and not Red Tribe either. Meanwhile, there's some revanchist with a Confederate flag muttering the N-word and the someone calls him an anti-Semite, and he scratches his head and says "Wasn't our Secretary of State named Judah Benjamin?"
Black anti-semitism goes back quite a ways, actually- it’s always been part of black power/black liberation.
Agreed, but I guess I'm not American enough to consider that "a long time".
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That's very recent and mostly confined to a small subset of Blue tribe. So far it's not much compared to hundreds of years of being pogromed by people who seemed more like Red tribe.
You can get viscerally upset watching some people celebrate the killing of your co-ethnics without it making you decide that their entire ethnic group is inherently unassimilable to Western civilization. And I think that Jews have been turning more against Muslim immigration recently.
I feel like this is a comfy US Jewish view that’s been accepted for a long time. I don’t believe the state of Israel shares this view.
Abu Zubaydah when he was captured told the CIA officer that he didn’t really want to kill Americans he just wanted to kill Jews.
The main difference between third world antisemitism and white antisemitism is whites are very good at war. Overall Western Europeans are likely less antisemitic than other groups but when we do turn on Jews we can kill a lot of them.
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These two issues were relevant enough for them to (successfully) lobby for state actions like deportations and withdrawal of government funds. If they were such a small issue that they don't warrant any reciprocical support, their requests should have been denied. Hell, they should not have made them in the first place.
Well, they're not a monolith. Some of them wanted such radical actions, some were opposed, some indifferent.
My overall point is that, even though Jews in Western countries have been moving a bit to the right recently, white-dominated right-wing populist movements probably have, to a Jewish perspective, so much historical baggage that I don't expect 80% of Jews to support them any time in the near future. They might do it if Muslims rise to make up like 20% of Western populations or something. Even then I'm not sure.
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