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Well, when you thought the week was boring...
Charlie Kirk was just shot at an event, shooter in custody. There's apparently a video going around of the attack, but I haven't a desire to see it. People who have seen it are suggesting he was shot center mass in the neck, and is likely dead. That makes this the second time that a shooter targeted a conservative political figure at a political event in two years. If Trump hadn't moved his head at the last second, it would've been him, too.
I've never followed the young conservative influencers much, but Kirk always seemed like the moderate, respectable sort -- it's wild that he would be the victim of political violence and not someone like Fuentes.
I fear this is what happens when the culture war is at a fever pitch. Political violence in the US is at heights not seen since the 1970s, from riots in the 2010s and especially 2020 over police-involved shootings, to the capitol riot in 2021, to the attempted assassination of Trump in Pennsylvania, to the United Healthcare killing, to finally this murder of a political influencer. I fear for my country when I look at how divided we are, and how immanently we seem to be sliding into violence.
I guess I just find politics tiring nowadays. I vote for a Democrat and they do stupid things that conspicuously harm the outgroup. I vote for a Republican and they do stupid things that conspicuously harm the outgroup. Whether J.D. Vance or Gavin Newsom wins in 28, there will be no future in which Americans look each other eye to eye.
I actually believe things are much better in this country than people think: our economy is surprisingly resilient, we've never suffered under the kind of austerity that's defined post-colonial European governance, our infrastructure, while declining, actually functions in a way that most of the world isn't blessed with, our medical system is mired in governmental and insurance red tape yet the standard of care and state of medical research is world-class, our capacity to innovate technologically is still real and still compelling, and one of our most pressing political issues, illegal immigration, exists solely because people are willing to climb over rocks and drift on rafts simply to try and live here.
We have real problems. And intense escalations on the part of our political tribes are absolutely in the top five. We also have a severe problem with social atomization -- and these two things are related -- which has led to our intimate relationship and loneliness crisis, the rapid decline in social capital, and the technological solitary confinement of the smartphone screen which dehumanizes people like real solitary confinement while confining them to the most intense narrative possible. "If it bleeds, it leads" means that many will be led into bleeding.
I don't know how we rebuild the world, or come to a point where Americans of different views can view each other as well-intentioned. But Kirk is just the latest victim of a crisis that I don't know if there's any way to solve.
You think you hate TMZ enough, but you don't.
The office at TMZ can be heard loudly clapping and cheering live when the news that Charlie Kirk has died comes through
I'm allowed to say you should hate those people right? That's specific enough? With enough evidence? You can hate the people at TMZ you can hear loudly clapping and cheering the death of a husband, father and Christian? It's not more heat than light to make sure people know that's what TMZ is? That every time you see an article at TMZ, it's important to remember they would cheer your death.
Im usually biased toward Nothing Ever Happening but the lefts genera reaction to this is giving me Spanish civil war vibes. If the shooter turns out to be a leftist (most likely) then I see this possibly escalating
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I don't see any evidence other than the timing that the cheering was connected with Kirk's death. However, if it was, that wouldn't surprise me one bit. Plenty of people on both sides of the culture war feel happy when members of the other side die.
I know that you would almost certainly not publicize a video of right-wingers cheering the death of some leftist figure, so I take your comment as being tribalism rather than as an attempt to shed light on things.
Forecasting future behavior of a fellow internet rando is now ... evidence?
@WhiningCoil is definitely dancing with the mod tiger these past few days, but his post of the TMZ video is more than a bare-link and it is important and topical --- half of the replies in this thread are "it's not about the shooting itself, it's about the reactions."
Your comment asserting tribalism is tribalism itself. Or maybe just lower level general antagonism?
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Nah, this is actual psycho behavior. If you told me my most hated outgroup influencer or politican got shot my immediate, gut reaction is "Oh, no! They're going to be insufferable after this."
This is because America is still in a talking battle. When we hear that "someone shot up a campaign event", most partisans will hope that their side was the one being attacked. Because that gives them a powerful story, and free reign to attack the outgroup as bad. Most partisans don't want to be in the position of having to explain why the rest of them shouldn't be blamed because one guy went and did something horrible.
You openly cheer for the deaths of people that you are in physical battle with. Where PR and optics are a negligible concern compared to who is left standing to write the history.
So what does it mean if the staff at a mainstream media company like TMZ think that they are in a war to the knife with Charlie Kirk?
They're claiming it was unfortunate timing:
I have no idea who or what TMZ is, so I have no opinion one way or the other if this is true, but it's only fair to give them a chance to reply.
That's either an insultingly implausible lie, or insane enough that it has to be true.
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Yeah, this is me, in this thread, going "Damn these reactions are insufferable". But Kirk was far from someone who I would describe "most hated outgroup influencer" (I don't think I would ever use those words) - I just found his style extremely grating.
I haven't interacted with anyone in person whose reaction was more extreme than "how ironic".
A friend brought it up in the group Discord. He's, let's say "not as left as he thinks he is". But he raised the topic and immediately started with the "was the video AI manipulated to look worse?" And then when that was dismissed all around, worked in a "I'm sure there will be a lot of talk about politics and culture war before we learn in a week that it was a neighbor angry about the trash cans so we should probably just assume that, haha".
And the thing that struck me was that he came off as very defensive. Which is kind of unnecessary because as I said, he's really not as left as he thinks he is.
The other person who brought it up and had something to say was my mother, who cold opened a conversation with "Oh, I guess a Republican died? Boo hoo, thoughts and prayers." At least she isn't entirely gone; she responded like a human to being called out for it, but Christ.
The social media and it's consequences has been a disaster for the Boomer women.
For a cohort of GenX women too.
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TMZ denies this. Their explanation sounds unlikely to me, but at the very least they did eventually become ashamed enough to lie.
I believe this as much as someone caught with porn tabs open saying it was for research.
What if they said they had been going to whitehouse.com?
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Porn is far and away the best source for figure drawing references of hot women that exists in the world! I swear!!
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I guess I believe them? The cheers sound more like a group of people watching a movie than it does people reacting to news being spread by word of mouth. Is there any collaborating evidence that there was a car chase going on at the time?
Plus, this wasn't the shocking moment where he was shot, it was the moment trump announced he's dead. I doubt they were that excited over this almost-inevitable followup. I'm going to mark that episode as a red hate-fantasy.
I think you have to be actively looking to give them an out to buy this for a second. People don't laugh and clap at car chases.
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