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Steve Sailer has been suspended from Twitter for allegedly violating their rules against hateful conduct.
His tweet said
He appealed and the decision was upheld.
This is yet another way in which Elon Musk is going back on what he said in April.
It's starting to look like his attitude towards free speech isn't that different from his predecessors'.
Even I am stary to wary of the black crime narrative, although I strongly oppose Saylor being suspended for the tweet. Yeah, maybe it's true in terms of smaller crime or property crime or drug crime, but blacks are not creating madoff, theranos, or FTX-sized crimes. Look at the people involved in FTX...not a black among them. Caroline Ellison, Bankman-Fried , and Gary Wang...real black-sounding names, huh. Look at the FBI most wanted list..no blacks among them, although it's quite diverse. Look at the race of people who commit investor fraud or identity theft, no blacks, even though those crimes have way more victims and damage. A single hacker can compromise thousands of identities, steal millions of dollars. It's like there is no one group or race that is immune to doing crime. It's just that different races more more likely to engage in different types of crimes, which affect people in different ways. Financial fraud affects a lot of people at once, often involving a lot of money, whereas murder is way worse for the victim, but only a single victim. Hell ,even the Amish commit crime https://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/16-sentenced-in-amish-beard-cutting-case
FTX scam is moving money from one pocket to another with small net loss to society. While violent crime creates large burden on victim with very small benefit to attacker.
different types, when summed, all perfectly align to a harm value equal for every other race?
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Is there no over represented particularly swindle prone minority that commits financial crimes?
Regarding Jews and financial crime, Jews are overrepresented, but this could be explained by more Jews overall being employed in the financial services sector. Jews seem to be drawn to these high-status professions, such as law, government, or finance. You you would have to determine what percentage of Jew-run vs gentile-run financial firms or investments engage in fraud, which tells you more than just looking at the population. There are enough gentiles who engage in major investment fraud, like Enron, that it's hardly only a Jewish problem.
Enron: evidence for the heuristic that any company feting a female executive is a bad investment.
Are you referring to Rebecca Mark, who was a CEO of a wholly-owned subsidiary of Enron? And in what way was she feted? You're not making your argument, and this is a bad comment. At most, women made up 1 out of 4 of the key scumbags of that operation, and the fraction drops lower if you look at people outside the top executives.
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Check the early-life entry for the Enron CFO.
good catch. thank you Wikipedia
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Woah there buddy, some racial crime statistics are off limits here.
(Now I'm really curious if the reaction against "2 do ??" would be stronger than against "13 do 60")
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I agree that financial crimes should be dealt with more harshly, but violent crime affects more than the victim and are costly to society as a whole. Chicago is taking funds out of pensions because the city is in debt, but it would not be in debt if it has the violent crime rate of Tokyo. The costs of crime are
increased need for police funding, training, officers
increased need for ambulances, EMTs
A significant drain on medical services from all the emergency room stabbing and shooting victims who never pay the debt
Flight of intelligent and wealthy people
Reduced investment in the city
Reduced civic engagement and a concomitant social decay (ugliness)
Need for more judges, public defenders
Need to pay to bring the criminals to trial, and then to house them
The lower class has to pay for more/better locks, can’t use a bicycle so might have to buy a car, Dashcam, Ring, security system, personal defense weapon, different insurances policies
Reduced use of public transit
There are also behaviors that go alongside criminality
A general feeling of doom and unease when walking certain areas of city
A horrifying fear that your daughter is subject to gang culture propaganda as a child and ruins her life, or your son gets into a gang, or either of them get into drugs and alcohol
A fear that your childrens’ peers are terrible for their development and hold them back or instill in them a raw consumerism/avarice/narcissism
Worry that your partner or female friends may be assaulted or raped
Increased risk of riots with property taxes
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This is unconvincing for several reasons. One being the obvious one that violent crime is different than other crime. Another being that FTX is just one instance of fraud; you have presented no data showing that fraud is committed disproportionately by whites and Asians. A third being that the Most Wanted List isn't about criminals generally; it's about fugitives specifically; it's a very small and non-random selection and may in fact be subject to political pressure on the race issue.
Alternatively, blacks could just be worse at avoiding capture.
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I mean major financial fraud. I far as I know, there are zero notable cases of African Americans engaging in major financial fraud. I could only find one example on the FBI most wanted list https://www.fbi.gov/wanted/wcc/james-stewart-jr But this is tiny relative to Enron-sized frauds. Meanwhile, if you look at the break down of the biggest frauds ever, no African American to be found. Idenity theft, stolen IDs, crypto scams, ransomware, etc. no blacks (unless you include Nigerians) but lots of Eastern Europeans and Russians.
The key phrase is "disproportional". How many frauds of that level are there compared to the number of black people with such well-connected, high finance positions? Just saying that there are aren't many black frauds overall, ignores proportions.
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The most notable overrepresented group is jews. Jews being around 2% of the US population, they are at least 9% of lower category white-collar crimes (bank embezzlement, tax fraud and bank fraud), at least 15% of moderate category white-collar crimes (mail fraud, false claims, and bribery), and at least 33% of high category white-collar crimes (antitrust and securities fraud). In total, according to Crimes of the Middle Classes: White-Collar Offenders in the Federal Courts from 1991, jews were responsible for 23.9% of all white collar crime.
So, when you say 'lots' with regards to Russians and Eastern Europeans, how large a percentage are you talking about?
I mean to say this type of crime, such as identity theft, ransomware, hacking, crypto scams, etc. is almost always done by this group . My point is that it's not one group has a monopoly on crime, but rather different groups seem to engage in different types of crime.
I don't understand the relevance of the point or how it relates to anything Sailer, or anyone else, has said.
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I don't feel your post has much relevance to the tweet given it specifies homicides. Considering that specification it seems completely correct.
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This feels somehow wrong, because despite occasionally producing SBF or Theranos, Palo Alto is still a nice civilized place and the same can’t be said for the black murder rate in places suffering from that. SBF had zero tangible effect on me, black crime has made entire neighborhoods and cities no-go zones.
One for one, a single SBF may produce more total harm than a single murderer, but for every one SBF there are probably thousands of murders, and innumerable assaults and lesser crimes.
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There is a difference between statistical deaths and murder. The first has enough links separating the action from the cause that one could be fairly said not to realize the specific harm. Murder of course one knows that he is killing another human.
This isn’t a defense of statistical deaths. White collar crime should be punished severely. SBF — assuming he is as guilty as he appears — shouldn’t be a free man until his 60s. Ditto Holmes.
Yet they aren’t murderers. I do believe murderers are worse morally. Further, I think rampant murder is worse for a community than fraud.
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SBF is a bad example, FTX misappropriated ten thousand times the value of the median US home*. Even given the greater collateral damage and surprise of a physically burned home, FTX did more harm by wiping out investments, retirement funds. Very plausible he caused a suicide (although that's different from 'murder' because lots of suicides happen anyway, the effect needed to cause a suicide is less than that needed to kill a random person). Ten thousand retirement funds wiped out is comparable to 'destroying a neighborhood'.
It's more reasonable to compare smaller-scale white collar crime, e.g. defrauding $50k, to widespread theft and murder. Even then, how does one compare financial scams or hacking to theft?
*there are 20 reasons this is the wrong statistic, but they don't change the 10k
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Er, ultimately it's children who can't afford college, someone who has to sell their house or shut down their business to pay back loans, someone being divorced because they lost money, etc. The 'numbers on a spreadsheet' are important because we use them to exchange all significant resources. If you burn down a house, that's "numbers on a spreadsheet" in insurance, but that insurance is the only reason the family can afford .
Let's say I switch some 'numbers in a spreadsheet' in a bank and steal all of a person's income and savings, and they lose their job, get evicted because they can't pay rent, get divorced and the wife takes the kids, etc. How is that different from burning down a house?
(again FTX is an unusually large-scale example of white-collar crime - $8B is a lot of money)
There's a separate issue here of culpability in that it's fraud - all the people who invested in FTX were either stupid or taking unnecessary risk, and should lose their money, which is somewhat true. Or that crypto trading is fundamentally parasitic anyway (HFT improves liquidity and allows for more efficient capital allocation or something, but what's being efficiently allocated here?). But that's not at all characteristic of white-collar crime generally. And a similar argument goes for theft, anyway - carry a gun, put criminals in jail, or it's your fault!
Weren't FTX's investors mostly institutional investors, VC funds, etc., meaning the damage will be widely distributed?
It's not just investors who lost money, users who had funds on the site are out right now as well
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I mean investments as in ""investments"" retail ie random people made in bitcoin. Quite a few people put most or all funds into crypto.
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that depends where you live, i suppose. Same for SBF...people who didn't invest in crypto or use FTX were not affected. Of course, one can choose to not invest in crypto, but way harder to relocate. Murder does have considerable ripple effects on overall neighborhood.
Only if you mean to reference somewhere outside the United States. Basically every large metropolitan area is significantly warped by the question of black crime. Its represented in rents, commute times, taxes, etc. This is what white flight was all about. There are otherwise very good neighborhoods to live in (re:proximity to business hubs) that are essentially wasted because they are full of criminals and those who tolerate them.
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