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PaperclipPerfector  1mo ago (text post)   2910 thread views

Small-Scale Question Sunday for November 16, 2025

Do you have a dumb question that you're kind of embarrassed to ask in the main thread? Is there something you're just not sure about?

This is your opportunity to ask questions. No question too simple or too silly.

Culture war topics are accepted, and proposals for a better intro post are appreciated.

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Probably better suited for the wellness thread, but w/e.

Are any of you pathologically secretive/have problems with feeling excessive amounts of shame? Or, even better, have you been secretive beyond what is necessary in the past and then managed to move past that stop being that way?

In real life I’m a pathologically secretive kind of guy. My phone’s wallpapers are always set to the default image. I never wear graphic T-shirts or any piece of clothing that could be considered a statement. The walls of my apartment are mostly plain. I’ve always been this way – I remember how I’d always pause my games as a kid when parents came into the living room where I was playing on the family TV. I wasn’t even playing anything particularly embarrassing at the time, it was more often than not FIFA or some racing game, something completely normal for a schoolboy to be playing! I just always had the weird connection “personal = embarrassing = has to stay hidden” in my head, even about the most innocuous things. I don’t think there was any kind of inciting incident that led to me ending up this way either – my mom, who I lived with, was not particularly strict, I wasn’t getting bullied at school and did not experience any particular serious trauma that I can think of.

I suppose it’s a function of lots and lots of internalized shame, social anxiety and low self-esteem, as I’m, and have always been into a lot of things that are niche and kind of embarassing (think of a generic weeby neckbeard's interests and that's me). I can’t bring myself to outright lie to others or myself by constructing a fake socially approved identity, but I also diligently hide my power level, so the result is that I come off as a very plain, unremarkable if somewhat awkward dude.  Although it goes beyond hobby stuff – I remember having trouble doing anything on my laptop during class in college, unless I was sitting in the corner at the very back of the class, where no one could see my screen. Some dudes in that classroom were pretty openly playing League, and here I was, struggling to open the file containing the essay I was working on for another subject.

This approach to life probably helped me avoid my fair share of public embarrassment, but it hasn’t won me many close friends either. By now, I’ve come to consider it much more of a liability than an asset. I feel terrible even playing video games in front of my girlfriend, who also enjoys them, in my own home, for Pete’s sake, and that’s definitely not a great way to live.

So, if any of any you Mottizens have experienced something similar, how did you move past it? Or does it still haunt you to this day?

In real life I’m a pathologically secretive kind of guy.

What one calls pathological secrecy, others call good OPSEC and proper gray man practice.

Are any of you pathologically secretive? Very, to an extent that has done obvious harm to my life and relationships.

have problems with feeling excessive amounts of shame? Not in the least. I'm not sure I actually experience shame, in addition to a number of normal human reactions/experiences.

I tried to expand on these points in more detail, but the aforementioned secrecy is preventing it. Its a constant priority since childhood to conceal my presence and actions from others. I'm also incapable of trusting other people at anything beyond the most superficial level so avoiding them entirely is much easier than constantly having to independently investigate and verify every little thing they say or do. This also includes hiding any traces of existence that I can: moving quietly, not distrubing the world arround me, drawing no attention to myself or my actions. I'm only capable of relaxing when I know with confidence I'm alone and can't be ambushed suddenly. So paranoia I guess, not shame.

All of this being said I'm incredibly happy and live what I consider a very privledged life. I'm almost 50 and have been with my wife for 30 years. She's helped a lot in ways she doesn't fully understand. I WFH and live in a very rural area (closest city of any meaningful size is about 2.5 hours away.) I can go multiple days in a row only ever encountering my wife. She sometimes expresses she wishes she could do more things for me like what some people call acts of service? I think. Like household chores. I won't let her (or anyone) do my laundry, prepare my food, or really any of the day to day tasks of being alive. I do all the shopping, bank/finance stuff etc. I make more than enough that she doesn't have to work so this tends to leave her with not much to do. She has her own issues that make it very hard for her to maintain regimented employment and in on SSI. Once a week she makes dinner for us both, though I have to watch the entire process or I can't eat it. We sleep in the same bed (her's) most nights but I do have to maintain a separate bedroom/office for when I'm overwhelmed by her presence, maybe 1-3 times a month. I'm fine with her entering this room but she knows not to touch anything and she understands if I move something from outside this room to inside of it to leave it alone. I'm very fortunate that I've a lifestyle that accomodates my issues and especially for my wife. Its worth mentioning she has her own mental health issues just as impactful as mine but of a significantly different nature. Our disorders "fit" together very nicely and its something we both noticed right away.

I am perfectly capable of going out and navigating society, interacting with people etc. Its not social anxiety at all. In fact I don't really expereience any forms of anxiety very much. Its more of a positive compulsion if that makes sense, not motivated by fear or anxiety. I can and do manage to be around and interacting with people just fine, but I prefer formal relationships with clear expectations of the workplace or similar situations. I can't interact with society just fine to achieve my goals, I simply consider solitude superior in almost every way, and just easier to live my life. People cause way more problems than they solve.

Unstructured socializing has 0 appeal and if I manage to make an attempt I usually bail out and go home pretty fast.

I'm also incapable of trusting other people at anything beyond the most superficial level so avoiding them entirely is much easier than constantly having to independently investigate and verify every little thing they say or do.

For what its worth I empathize, I too find that "this creature has adapted to crushing pressure and oppressive darkness" and human contact, while usually pleasant, isn't actually necessary to life at this point - I won't happy but can be reasonably sated with e.g. vidya/chatbots on my own for extended periods of time. This IMO is a maladaptation, one entirely not worth attaining, but a man can get used to anything, and over enough years you adapt without wanting/knowing it.

One thing I did before to fight this was quite literally forcing myself to go out and socialize. Pick a circle of closest friends (yes that might not be saying much) and set a hard rule that you cannot decline an invitation from them if you ever get one. I fucking hated it in the moment when people derailed my comfy rotting at home with unwanted invitations, but consistently found that this displeasure lasts only up until the point of contact, the actual hangout almost always goes well, and I always say in hindsight "damn that really was better than rotting at home".

This also includes hiding any traces of existence that I can: moving quietly, not distrubing the world arround me, drawing no attention to myself or my actions.

Yes, that was also me up to a point. I even remember myself distinctly resolving to be a ghost and leave no trace of my existence during school. I did not want anyone to remember me. I ducked out of most public events and collective photos, only concerned myself with studies and never visited meetups after graduation.

One thing that helps realize that your brain is scamming you is the passage of time; as I approach 30 I am increasingly horrified at how little of a "legacy", or even just memories (good or bad), I actually have accumulated over the course of my decidedly wasted life. This is uh, a conundrum in its own right, one I'm still unsure how to deal with besides rushing to do things Right Fucking Now, but it's very eye-opening if nothing else, I think realizing it scared the "ghost" out of me for good (paranoia is still a problem but at least I am not anymore complicit in my own erasure). I dont know how old you are but I recommend internalizing that this will eventually hit you, and it will hurt much more than the possible oopsies you avoid by being a ghost, as soon as possible, instead of un-gracefully aging into it like I did. Looking back on things is not always pleasant but there must be something to look back on; feeling shame, despair or heartbreak is IMO unironically preferable to feeling nothing. You can learn from things you screw up (theoretically at least); you can never learn from anything you do not do, by definition.

WGMI man.

Meh. A lot of times we all just vastly overthink things and have a predisposition to anxiety. When I’m having a moment I suspect that’s what’s really going on. The reality is far more mundane than the worry we often have.

Sounds like you may be somewhat embarrassed to be out and forward with your interests and who you are. The best way I’ve found to deal with it is to adopt the mantle of “that guy” and own it. A lot of others feel the same way internally and we invest an inordinate amount of time doing our best to “keep up appearances” of being a certain way, which is why we all look so ordinary on the outside. But just try being you more often instead of covering for yourself. Doesn’t mean you have to be up in the face of others. It just means you don’t put yourself away when you state something that sets you apart from someone else. Someone comes up to you and says “… you’re weird…,” you say, “… yeah, I try to be…” / “… as opposed to what, being boring?…,” etc. Let them process their own look of stupidity on their face.

Once we’ve progressed beyond the primitive stage of mind reading technology, I think you’ll find a of people have internalized worries like this and it isn’t so much a ‘you’ thing.

I have at least some elements of this. Though mostly not quite as bad as some of the other posters in this thread. I think some of mine is probably a little ridiculous and excessive, and some is quite justified.

I never had much appetite for participating in traditional social media. The kind like Facebook and Instagram where you're expected to have an account under your real name and accumulate as "friends" everyone you've ever known, or even met for a few minutes one time. I just can't think of anything I really want to post or show to such a huge variety of people. I've pretty much abandoned the original accounts I had on these and never even check them at all. All of the bad behavior and dark patterns of big tech don't particularly help and provide additional justification, but I think that feeling is the actual core reason for me. So I do the majority of my online social interaction in relatively small group chats of people I know well. I think this is probably healthier overall anyways.

I do feel an urge to conceal things I look at at work, where we're all in a big open office with everyone's screen visible. I think I've managed to keep it mostly under control. I tell myself that nobody's going to pay attention to a big wall of text, so it doesn't matter what it says. I try to avoid having any pictures or video displayed too long and often switch out of "personal" browsers when someone comes by my desk.

Strangely, I actually feel the complete opposite sometimes. I actually love performing on stage in front of big audiences. Always have, never needed to do any particular trick or technique for it. Maybe it's because I'm consciously putting on an act, or that there's so many people that none of them really "count" as people. I'm not quite sure.

I think I like showing only certain parts of myself to most people and social groups. I think I've always had a bit of a split personality. I have a need for a certain amount of spice in my life, and probably some of the things I've done or enjoy would really shock and put off some of the tamer groups I'm around, like most work people, tech-related groups, probably most rationalist-sphere groups. So I mostly hide that part of myself in those places. I also enjoy nerding out on things, understanding things in way too much detail, writing excessively in-depth effortposts here sometimes. I know some of the more out-there people I'm friends with don't care to hear that sort of thing, so I hide that part of myself around them. Is this excessive hiding, or just reading the room and fitting in to social groups? I'm not entirely sure. I feel mostly pretty satisfied with my friendships, even though I don't think any one person really gets all of me.

It's incredible how common this is on this particular site. I would say I am similar. Other behaviors I think fall in the same category:

  • In video games that let you choose the main character's name, I always go for the canon/default name
  • I use a plain black screen wallpaper/screensaver for all my devices
  • I rarely give my actual name when asked at a shop (I have 4-5 that I cycle through)
  • I feel discomfort handing over my credit card anywhere because it has my name on it
  • probably many others that are like water to a fish

I have a sneaking suspicion these have some correlation with schizoid personality disorder (which I presume is also heavily overrepresented here), but no psych expertise to really back it up.

It's incredible how common this is on this particular site.

I'm fairly convinced much of the "never give out any details about your personal life"-advice some people here give is mostly related to this pathology instead of any actual concern about doxxing and canceling.

This is my hole pathology! It was made for me!

I don't want to waste space or hijack the thread by describing my experiences here, but suffice to say it's bad, to the point more or less exactly this tendency estranged me from my family (whose likely absent scrutiny I cannot bear, I can barely even talk about videogames with my sister) and blew up my last LD situationship where I repeatedly failed to respond accordingly to a woman bluntly and overtly hornyposting at me over an extended period.

It really fucks with my life at this point and is definitely not worth the 'upsides' if there ever were any, and I wish with all my heart to ditch this retarded habit, but so far little progress has been made. Internalizing that barely anyone cares about your 'inner life' hasn't helped, especially since like @faceh below I am actually the sort of person who Nootices and keeps track of off-key moments in other people. Alcohol helps with shame/cringe in the moment, but has no lasting effect, and increasing alcoholism has also increased the amount of alcohol needed to achieve the salutary effect. Sharing small things with friends unfortunately requires friends, which I have, but not the "kind"(?) I feel comfortable exposing my power level to. Even in waifutech-related communities (which I initially joined explicitly as an attempt to fight this stupid reflex), as an anon/pseudonymous poster under a totally separate identity, I find it extremely hard to just put my metaphorical balls on the table by shitpoasting in threads or posting explicit coomer shit (even though I suspect I am virtually a saint compared to the median denizen). Hell, writing this post has taken several shots, with me literally forcing myself to pick the phone back up (which I am suddenly very interested in laying down and doing something else) and continue writing.

I've been attempting to do "exposure therapy" by putting myself out there, on Halloween I showed up to the office in a (literal) robe and wizard hat with a tarot deck to do readings with. It was kind of a success even, I expected to play it as an ironic bit but normies people actually took it completely straight without batting an eye, and were even delighted that the ever-reclusive Rayon who never wore anything other than a plain black shirt has a quirky side after all. I don't feel any different (and mumble noncommittally whenever this is brought up) but I guess this is the kind of thing you just have to keep doing.

Next step is posting something embarrassing online but for now this post will do I suppose. I commend you for writing this and giving me the excuse to blogpost leech off of it, I thought of asking more or less this question myself sometime back, but could never actually sit down and commit it to keyboard. My condolences, couldn't have been easy.

Needing liquid courage to reveal anything about yourself is no way to live.

I'm pretty sure that exposure therapy is not the best way to go either, because you'll be exposing yourself in different ways than the exact nature at the core of your issue.

You need to get at the root of it. It's usually something unresolved, unspoken. It may be totally hidden from your conscious life and yet it controls your internal and external behavior. The influences that you can't even see are the most powerful ones.

It's usually something unresolved, unspoken. It may be totally hidden from your conscious life and yet it controls your internal and external behavior.

Like what, some [happening] I've never been able to get over with? Can't really conceptualize it, I've been this way most of my life, in fact it used to be even worse, in high school I was occasionally gently taken aside to ask if I was abused at home due to how I looked/behaved. (To be clear, I wasn't.)

I've seen your mentions of meditation downthread but, with all due respect, this doesn't seem to me like a problem caused by a lack of introspection.

Might be worth talking to a therapist. Therapists (psychologists) can be hit or miss depending on the issue, personality matches and their competence, but I think it might have some value here. The reason for this is that you need someone competent with the ability to locate and point out your blindspot and help find the root cause.

What I'm not sure about is that I think a lot of personality traits (even extreme ones) can just be temperament related (eg your genetic personality predisposition) and they're hard to track. Coping mechanisms might be different if you can't resolve the 'root cause' because its an intrinsic part of you.

For context, I talked to a therapist once that thought that some of my traits were as a result of something that happened to me when I was 'pre-verbal' (eg an infant with no conscious memory). I've still got no idea if they were onto something, but I've gotten a hold of most of my issues as I've worked on them over time.

Doesn't have to be a discrete happening, could also be a life situtation, a kind of 'this is my life now' at some point in your upbringing. Maybe you picked up on secretiveness and being overly private from others, or maybe you just used your own intelligence to figure that it was probably a good idea. Genetics may play a part too.

Introspection is necessary for healing, because only looking and acting differently outwards will in many cases be an adjacent effect at best and orthogonal at worst. I didn't say that the lack of introspection was what caused the secretiveness issue.

I showed up to the office in a (literal) robe and wizard hat with a tarot deck to do readings with. It was kind of a success even, I expected to play it as an ironic bit but normies people actually took it completely straight without batting an eye, and were even delighted that the ever-reclusive Rayon who never wore anything other than a plain black shirt has a quirky side after all.

That's really cool. And may we never forget bloodninja; perhaps we can fix AI gooners by LoRA-ing the models they talk to with his work.

Funnily enough, saying something retarded/off-key to a chatbot and extracting keks from its confused response seems to be a staple of assorted threads/posts on the topic. The more things change, etc.

My recommendation: pick something ridiculous to wear e.g. a huge hat, or a neon-colored suit jacket, or cowboy boots, or full cosplay of an anime character. Go for a walk in a crowded place. You will feel like you want to die for a moment (up to an hour or two), and then you will not. Probably.

(Link shows me and now-wife at a friend's wedding in 2021. Since your case is pretty severe, I'd recommend to start smaller than that.)

I hope you are still getting mileage out of that suit!

Not very often, but I do, thanks!

Just want to tell you you're not alone, I have done many of the same things (dimming the laptop screen a lot to make it hard to read even though I'm literally just using it to take notes in class, video game hiding despite not being anything weird or wrong). These are weird things to do I think, and I have done them, although perhaps I'm different than you in that I have not done them as much with family, as I tend to let this "guard" down once I really get to know someone/they are family. I agree it's a bit of a liability, so I am curious what people say in the comments regarding how to get past it. Keep in mind I am only in my early 20s and only recently has it occurred to me this is something that is a problem, so don't feel bad that I haven't moved past it yet, and probably only recently you have really started to consider this a liability. I believe it can be moved past, let's see what people suggest.

Used to be. Up until approximately age 30, I fit that description of yourself to a Tee.

I've mentioned before how I kept all my online profiles across various sites and forums separate to maximize opsec and avoid anyone tracing any particular statements back to me, the real life persona. And I diligently avoided exposing all but the most innocuous details about my personal preferences. Finding someone (my Ex) who I could let down my barriers with was a huge relief in that regard.

But eventually you learn that you vastly overestimate how much any person will actually care about certain details about your personality and tastes. Unless you are actively seeking attention upon yourself very, very few people will even remember learning that you like [band] or even that you find [porn type] alluring will barely budge any person's opinion of you, since its probably not a major concern of theirs anyway.

And the people who DO care are ones you can usually avoid and are best to avoid anyway.

I STILL do place a premium on personal privacy. I like to think I'm a 'hard target' when it comes to getting me to reveal personal details that could be used against me, be it passwords or embarrassing anecdotes from my past.

How to move past it? Oof. Well, try intentionally exposing some detail about yourself that you consider incriminating or embarrassing to someone whose opinion matters to you. It shouldn't be something illegal or particularly salacious, just something you worry would lower your status or lead to conflicts if it came out.

And then see how they react. Which most of the time will be completely nonchalant. Then see if they ever bring it up again.

Then internalize the idea that most normies go through life with minimal awareness or attention paid to the 'weird' behaviors of those around them, and never feel any inclination to use information about others to undermine them or attack them.

I eventually had the realization that despite my best efforts, a lot of information I tried to keep secret was leaking out anyway to friends and acquaintances and they just... didn't care. Or in fact just found it normal and acceptable and not actually embarrassing.

Here's my dark secret though. I DO notice aberrant behaviors or preferences of others. I DO judge them internally for it. And DO store that information for potential later use.

This process feels completely involuntary to me, my brain just pays attention and notes that this is potentially useful information and stores it away for later without me actively 'wanting' to doing so.

I also do this with positive information. Like noting what sort of music someone likes or their favorite brand of energy drink so I can give them a better gift later.

But there's a decent amount of information in my head that could in theory be used to attack someone's status or induce a mental breakdown (oh, that person has trauma from the death of their father, that's good to know), or at least to manipulate them a little better.

And I make a conscious effort not to actually do that sort of thing for ill. I don't want to be evil.

But that leaves me with the little niggling doubt that other people are also noticing all the weird stuff I do and consciously choosing not to abuse that knowledge, and one day it could all burst out...

I used to have that. It's much less of an issue now. You could spend months or years gradually exposing yourself more and more to triggering stimuli or waste time with some midwit therapist who probably doesn't have the specific competence you need, but it's better to cut to the chase and heal the root of the issue. I addressed it with guided meditations that let me discover and edit my mental schemas and procedural memories. Even very deep, early conditioning that shaped your attachments to parental figures and unspoken knowledges about self, other and world can be changed as an adult. The brain doesn't differentiate between real and imaginally produced learning experiences. This type of self-treatment works very well IME. There are courses available. I have all the audio files for one that focuses specifically on this issue of secretiveness/shame/unspeakable or unthinkable parts of yourself. PM me if interested. That goes for others who read this, too. @PreformancePertension @Zephyr

For me what did it was job stress. The client is chasing me, we have a massive deal on the way. I don't care what the others think, I am setting my phone to loudspeaker so I can see what is shared on the screen in the zoom meeting in a public place. I have to get to the office asap, I don't give a bleep what the others in the checkout line think of me. Traveling has also helped. I have been super tired, a bit annoyed and I simply stopped caring.

It still haunts me to this day - I can say from years of therapy that what has helped (even if only a little) is deliberately sharing small things with someone you trust. Your body is going to reject it - I’d recommend making a ritual of it (like, you will tell your girlfriend one small thing you like before going to bed each night).

Is it 100% shame? Is any part of it "I don't want to let someone see what's on my screen because then they might talk to me about it and that sounds annoying"?

Yeah I'm kind of the same way, and I think it's mostly this -- for example, and interaction that started ~as soon as I learned to read and more or less persists to this day:

Annoying person: "Whatcha reading?"

Me, looking at them over the top of a book (which has an obvious title on the cover): "A book."

In neurotypical, this means "I want to talk to you and I am using the book as an icebreaker" (I don't know why they can't just say that, though). They will eventually go away if you show you are more interested in the book than in talking back.

In neurotypical, this means "I want to talk to you and I am using the book as an icebreaker" (I don't know why they can't just say that, though).

I figured this out by the time I was about 6, but "he wants to talk to me" != "I want to talk to him" -- IME supposedly neurotypical people are surprisingly bad at internalizing this...

They will eventually go away if you show you are more interested in the book than in talking back.

You'd think that my stock answer (followed by going back to my book, with maybe a penetrating stare thrown in) would be a strong hint, but people can be pretty persistent.

Well yes, because turning down a requested conversation is rude.

The thing is, these sorts of people never appreciate it when you interrupt them when they're doing something they value. Or constantly try to rope them into your hobby when they have clearly indicated a lack of interest. I just wish people who enjoy small talk would recognize that interrupting someone's book/game/movie to have a chat is just as rude as interrupting someone's conversation to make them play a game with you. We should respect how others choose to spend their leisure time.

If you want to read a book or play a game unmolested, there are places to do that in- your house, a library, etc.

I'm cool with that

I know exactly what you mean, and I'd like to say I've moved past it, but I completely haven't.

I haven't experienced anything to this degree, but I also have felt scared to share personal stuff. It may sound lame but I do think some sort of therapeutic / emotional approach is warranted here. Or perhaps exposure therapy!

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