domain:rifters.com
Southkraut
The rain fell gentlier.
14m ago
I remember that post! And damn, it's already been a year.
As back then, I still have no actual advice to give. My personal inclination would be to tough it out - according to your version, you haven't done any wrong, so unless you suddenly realize that you did indeed "sexually assault" her, it wouldn't do to grovel just to appease a crazy woman. If this ruins your social life, then...yeah, I get it, that sucks, but better have it ruined that way than by making yourself become an absolute doormat.
mrvanillasky
Indo Aryan Thot Leader
18m ago
Point taken
aqouta
43m ago
Yes, I don't go down the rabbit hole of porn either and keep my alcohol tastes to mid shelf stuff for the same reason.
Hoffmeister25
American Bukelismo Enthusiast
1hr ago
When I see these arguments all I can think of is: How? How will anyone do this or enforce what you are proposing?
Look, I think almost everybody here is in agreement with you about the extreme political/ideological difficulties in addressing this problem. To the extent that Americans are even willing to openly acknowledge the existence of the problem at all, we are viciously polarized about the root causes of it, and about what an attempt to fix it would even look like. One side (presented somewhat uncharitably) thinks we just need to expropriate more resources and guilt from the dominant white culture and the problem will somehow fix itself; the other side is hotly divided over whether genetics play any role at all, and the anti-genetics side has spent years screeching about the evils of eugenics, so they’re certainly not going to assent to any attempt to address the problem on a genetic/heritability level.
The practical difficulties of disentangling the genetic and cultural factors is a real one, but not a priori insurmountable. The existence of genetically-identical (or at least nearly identical) populations split along cultural lines, with large downstream effects in terms of life outcomes, is trivially observable. (North Korea vs. South Korea being the most obvious one.) We can infer from this that the reverse is achievable; undoing the cultural divide would ameliorate the differences in outcomes.
Now, with American blacks, we don’t have such a starkly-clear control group. We do have American descendants of Igbo immigrants, whose life outcomes are very markedly better than ADOS blacks; however, since Igbos are a fairly endogenous genetic ingroup and are not genetically identical to the ADOS founding population, it’s difficult to disambiguate to what extent genetics explain the difference. (Although at the very least it deals a powerful blow to the thesis that white racism against people with dark skin is the entire root cause of blacks’ worse life outcomes.)
Ultimately I think you and I are in agreement that the idea of bringing black life outcomes into complete parity with white life outcomes is a pipe dream, short of a decades-long coordinated eugenics program. (And maybe even that wouldn’t be enough.) Since that’s not going to happen, we can at least try to fiddle with the cultural dials in whatever way we can; perhaps we can draw some useful conclusions from that regarding the extent to which culture contributes to the life outcomes we’re observing.
Skulldrinker
1hr ago
She's not really part of my social circle, she just goes to the same pub my RPG club meets at. She vaguely knows one person I know, and I definitionally don't want to fuck any woman in her social circle.
sarker
It isn't happening, and if it is, it's a bad thing
1hr ago
That social class typically does not hold college degrees.
hanikrummihundursvin
1hr ago
I appreciate the reply, though it is tiresome to have the position I just argued against explained to me as if I just didn't know, understand or wasn't addressing it before. Then seeing all the arguments I just argued against... Eh.. Let me give you some examples to judge for yourself.
To begin with, the possibility of a better outcome does not change the fact that environments are heritable and there is no omnipotent hand ready to steer children away from criminal parents to minimize their chances of criminality. This is why I said that people have to be able to live with other people. Asserting that there was technically a chance to environmentally pacify someone with Brunner syndrome does not change the fact that they have Brunner syndrome whilst others do not. And whilst Raja doesn't have Brunner syndrome, he does seem to have a higher propensity towards violence than average. To that extent you are not arguing anything about genetics or environment, just asserting that with omnipotence we could change some outcomes. Well, I don't disagree, but we don't have omnipotence. So with what does that leave us?
As a second example, when I say bad parenting doesn't fall from the sky, and you reply with the assertion that it is cultivated over generations, I am left perplexed. How does that answer where it comes from? And if it persists over generations, what exactly are the conditions that produce and maintain it? Like, you are asserting a theory of psychology and sociology that, if true, should be extremely well studied and have very clear and visibly interactable effects. Are the results of adoption studies really so definitive in that direction? As far as I remember, children of criminal parents adopted into non criminal families still have higher rates of criminality. So we are at making the best of a sub-average situation in the hopes that it won't metastasize into something worse again?
When I see these arguments all I can think of is: How? How will anyone do this or enforce what you are proposing? You are taking a hypothesized maximum potential of people and asserting that the genetic component is negligible because in a hypothesized scenario most everyone could be raised to be a good person if removed from their inherited environment and have all negative impulses stifled somehow. My point would be that we don't live in such a world. Instead we live in a world were the Rampage Jacksons of the world can raise their own children and freely express whatever impulses they have. And my argument relies on that world being our point of comparison. Because there are so many people who have lived hard lives, had few opportunities, been used and abused, and never once been close to expressing the type of sub-humanism displayed by Raja.
birb_cromble
1hr ago
Instead of retroactively CWing this, I'm mostly interested if any Mottizens had any direct experience with Katrina in the Louisiana.
I have some family that lived in South Louisiana prior to Katrina. When I was young I lived with them for about a year while my mom dried out.
They live in Tennessee now because the town where they lived is gone. The roads you took to get there are gone. The islands and sandbars that acted as anchor points for all the infrastructure are gone.
Katrina was devastating.
No_one
1hr ago
Emotionally it must have been very bad, especially the futility but tactically & casualty wise it was not a real war, more of a relatively sedate counterinsurgency.
No_one
1hr ago
Sure, if by liberalism we mean something that doesn't exist anymore and has been supplanted by wokeness in practice.
Classical liberalism is larval wokeness, or more precisely, wokeness came into being to profitably exploit liberalism. There's no reason to be extra careful about terms here, both are very bad news.
Sloot
2hr ago
Most pleasant ${CurrentYear} dating experience. Things are bleak when even neurodivergent nerdy girls in their early 30s act like spoiled children.
Date a nerdy girl, they said. There's less drama with nerdy girls and they won't play mean-girl head-games like the sorority girl types, they said.
Date a woman in her 30s, they said. Women in their 30s are more mature and level-headed than younger women whose brains haven't even fully developed yet, they said.
Hey I didn't get to say this because we were surrounded by people but you've never apologized for sexually assaulting me on my birthday last year and I would appreciate an apology as that ruined my birthday and has made me feel not okay about you ever since
I kind of admire the chutzpah in a way. Have you stopped beating your wife?
I already apologized to her way back at the beginning of all this. I considered replying with a terse apology, a reminder I had previously apologized, and a promise to never acknowledge her again, because I don't feel okay about her either. Instead, I blocked her on everything and will ignore her going forwards. This isnt a good-faith interaction, this is a person either fucking with me, or of questionable sanity. I'm not going to feed the beast.
Never apologize when there's nothing to apologize for. It's just an admission of guilt and leaves more chum in the water for sharks.
She could actually fuck up my social life quite a bit if she wanted to, that bar is VERY important to me; most of my non-roommate friends in the city were met through that RPG club and the surrounding social context.
This reminds me of why I've never thought of social circles as a reliable/renewable dating source, and generally play it relatively conservatively when I do make an attempt. A failed attempt with a chick in your social circle, even without her slandering you afterward, can lead to your reputation being tainted and ruin future chances with other chicks in your social circle due to female mate-choice copying. If she slanders you afterward, that could mean you gaining pariah-status and getting excommunicated from the social circle altogether.
EvanTh
2hr ago
(or a play instead of a film in Lewis's time)
Lewis was writing during WWII; film was very much a thing.
You can fill a theater with a film about romance
But they'd be coming for the story, for the actors, for the poetry of the lines, and for many other things besides just seeing a couple kiss. Remember that you can also fill a theater for a film about many other things besides romance. A strip-tease doesn't have any of that.
No_one
2hr ago
full text is here if anyone's curious
Lori Harber, third-year student at Maxwell College:
Calli is for wusses. My attitude is, fight back. Go radical ugly. That's what the beautiful people need to see.
I got my nose taken off about this time last year. It's a bigger deal than it sounds, surgery-wise; to be healthy and stuff, you have to move some of the hairs further in to catch dust. And the bone you see (taps it with a fingernail) isn't real, it's ceramic. Having your real bone exposed is a big infection risk.
I like it when I freak people out; sometimes I actually ruin someone's appetite when they're eating. But freaking people out, that's not what it's about. It's about how ugly can beat beautiful at its own game. I get more looks walking down the street than a beautiful woman. You see me standing next to a video model, who you going to notice more? Me, that's who. You won't want to, but you will.
No_one
2hr ago
Season 1 is so good I stopped watching it 8 episodes in. It's just so predictable. Socialist realism. You can tell the writer read a few essays on fascism by the language people at ISA use. In the end it just bored me.
haroldbkny
2hr ago
Yikes. For some reason, I end up getting more scared off by any refined palate, non-vanilla, porn stuff. Even simple things like foot fetish porn kinda weirds me out. Maybe because I don't want to go down that rabbit hole, resulting in my being unable to fuck my wife, and then go down in an ever accelerating spiral, ending with me dying like David Carradine.
haroldbkny
2hr ago
Well I'm not too surprised that exists. But let's see if it catches on. I think there might have been a talk on the Motte a few years ago (I think) about how male sex toys will never achieve mainstream popularity, or even just sub-mainstream.
ZanarkandAbesFan
2hr ago
Fair enough
hydroacetylene
2hr ago
It's just part of good civil-military relations. A separate military caste has a very bad record, historically, because the military winds up being regarded as chuds and jailbirds who don't deserve the support of broader society, and it tends to slip out of the control of evolue political appointees.
stuckinbathroom
2hr ago
Specific link chosen for the soap because the writer has a crazy prosthetic eye.
Not surprised; she seems quite Moody!
Raja keeps regretting his decision; his father is the popular former MMA fighter Rampage Jackson, who keeps insinuating that he is gay for playing with people in rights and apologising to them.
Prior to the incident, Rampage was fairly beloved in online MMA spaces, even on Reddit—despite his habit of casual homophobia and sexually harassing/assaulting women on camera. The usual Who? Whom?, where the people who would usually pearl clutch at Problematic behavior will turn a blind eye depending on the idpol characteristics of the perpetrator. Aww, how sweet and hello human resources.
To be fair, Ramage has legitimate reasons to be beloved by online MMA spaces. He's part of two of the most iconic finishes in MMA history: his slam knockout of Richard Arona (although I content it was an accidental headbutt knockout) and him getting knocked out by Wanderlei Silva, where a flurry of knees from the Axe Murderer left Rampage's corpse dangling on the ropes, bleeding from the head. He had an entertaining and somewhat homoerotic rivalry with Rashad Evans, where Rampage 10-8'd a door along the way. There's also a general halo effect for Pride-era fighters out of nostalgia.
Blacks are overrepresented in crime stats for violent crimes. Raja is not high iq, clearly lacks impulse control, the biggest culprit in my eyes is his father.
I'd say the biggest culprit here is the 25-year-old man who decided to violently attack someone in the middle of a stage performance.
On /r/mma and /r/ufc, there was some recent nervous pearl-clutching at Rampage's old oddly prescient joke/remark about saving bail money for his black kids and college money for his half-Japanese kids. That was generally chalked up to Internalized Racism from living in a racist society, but was still proffered as a mitigating factor for Raja—the self-fulfilling prophecy of Stereotype Bias.
I've seen some blame Stu for triggering poor Raja's reactivity by smashing the empty (prop?) can on his head. How can he smesh? I've also seen some blame the wrestler who suggested to Raja to get his receipts (the wrestler has since been fired from the promotion). It's like whenever there's a black perpetrator of crime, there's a sizeable contingent who will make excuses and look to blame anyone but the perpetrator himself. Although granted, in this particular case, it's a relatively unpopular view to blame Stu or the receipt-suggester—even on Reddit, where it's been Noticed that so far, the suggester has suffered more consequences for the incident than has Raja.
This is not a "blacks suck", "13 52 lol" post.
I wonder if Stu or his family will pull a Jeff Metcalf. That is, they publicly forgive Raja but denounce the wrong-thinkers who place the incident as part of a recognized pattern.
Skulldrinker
2hr ago
Well, it happened. I've been frivolously accused of sexual assault.
Context: https://www.themotte.org/post/1092/wellness-wednesday-for-july-24-2024/234218?context=8#context
TLDR: I had a crush on an actual neurodivergent nerd girl in her early 30s, concocted a grand romantic gesture, had what I thought was a great evening with her where we kissed a few times. Then the next day she's coldly unhappy with me
Hey I'm gonna be real with you, I'm really not happy after you made out with me while I was drunk, that really upset me and it's not how I wanted my birthday to go
I apologize via text but hear nothing back from her. She hasn't seemed particularly drunk, and had lots of opportunity to ditch me.
There's a part 2 to this story,
I run into her again a few weeks later (this is 2024) and she gives me a big ole body hug and invites me to hang out, making me internally panic. There's other people around so I can't really have a frank conversation with her. At the end of the evening, I ask her if she'd like to get dinner sometime, so we can talk in private and I can hash out exactly how she feels about me. She reacts poorly.
Via text she accuses me of acting weird. My attraction to her is waning. Some choice quotes: "I'm so tired of straight guys assuming I'm not asexual, anyways I already have a crush." Never mind her "pretty people dont light their own cigarettes" line, asexual people apparently flirt pretty openly when they've had any amount of alcohol.
We have a pleasant-enough text conversation that firmly makes me dislike her, or rather dislike how leftist queer neurodivergent activist asexual feminism has taken someone I could have liked and made them a shitty person. I leave things at that, the matter has been settled.
This was a year ago. Recently, I run into her at the pub in question, with some of my friends. I give her a cordial hello, find out she's going back to school for political science (read: a degree in activism). I liked her more when she talked about Hellboy and her Fullmetal Alchemist fanfiction. She says something odd about seeing a mutual friend mention me on Facebook recently and it confusing her. I say "I'm glad you're doing well" and take my leave.
The next day I get this banger, which is really the star of this entire post.
>Hey I didn't get to say this because we were surrounded by people but you've never apologized for sexually assaulting me on my birthday last year and I would appreciate an apology as that ruined my birthday and has made me feel not okay about you ever since
I already apologized to her way back at the beginning of all this. I considered replying with a terse apology, a reminder I had previously apologized, and a promise to never acknowledge her again, because I don't feel okay about her either. Instead, I blocked her on everything and will ignore her going forwards. This isnt a good-faith interaction, this is a person either fucking with me, or of questionable sanity. I'm not going to feed the beast.
She could actually fuck up my social life quite a bit if she wanted to, that bar is VERY important to me; most of my non-roommate friends in the city were met through that RPG club and the surrounding social context.
No further encounters after two weeks. Still feels weird to be walking around with an accusation of sexual assault upon me.
hydroacetylene
2hr ago
That's certainly possible; I don't claim to be an expert on how gulf arabs break the rules.
Amadan
Enjoying my short-lived victory
2hr ago
Pretty clearly it was, and I have addressed that.
Now for you: you don't do yourself any favors by complaining that people are correctly diagnosing your heated culture warring in an unkind manner. People are not allowed to gratuitously insult you, but knock it off with the defensiveness after what you originally posted. After a rant about blacks and "pajeets" (which you edited out) you should really refrain from whining that people called that out.
This is one of the worst threads we've had recently, because your post was basically terrible in every way. Even the Holocaust deniers at least do some editing and organizing of their thesis and then don't blame the holes in their screeds on "I was tired."
Hoffmeister25
American Bukelismo Enthusiast
2hr ago
People have to be capable of living in the real world with other people. If they fail that it's not a matter of 'could would should' on behalf of everyone else to coddle these people into not being violent retards. Raja is 25 years old. He should be way past the point of pining for his fathers approval and attention like a dog. And way way past needing to hospitalize another person to do it.
You seem to have somehow gotten the impression that I’m arguing for leniency or grace toward this man. I’m very obviously not. He should be punished extremely strictly and probably never see the outside of prison walls. I am merely observing the patterns that seem to have landed him (and a very disturbingly large number of other black men) in this position. There’s nothing exculpatory about it.
Bad parenting doesn't fall out of the sky by chance. And the bad parents don't keep their bad genes to themselves.
I have made this point many time myself, right here on this very website. Cultures didn’t fall from the sky, assigned at random to different population groups. To an extent, the culture of American blacks is an expression of their innate capabilities and predispositions. However, it’s clearly not entirely so, because it’s also a very different culture from West Africa. It clearly has very strong elements of the Southern American culture into which American slaves were acculturated. (Honor culture elements, boastfulness, etc.)
There were changes in aggregate black culture between 1940 and 1990, and those changes did materially lead to a decline in life outcomes, in terms of things like criminality and out-of-wedlock births. The genetic substrate didn’t change. (One could make an argument about genetic selection effects leading only the most profligate black men to father children during this time, therefore subtly altering the proportions of various genetic traits within the population, but the time period is too short for this to matter, and also the evidence doesn’t seem to support this.)
If those cultural processes could be reversed — either from within black culture, or imposed from without — there would be measurable difference in life outcomes, even though the genetically-influenced things like average IQ and other cognitive limitations would remain. I don’t disagree with you that the higher average propensity for violent outbursts would still be there! That has been a feature of American black men (on average, in the aggregate, with a great many exceptions) for a long time. But it can be mediated by cultural pressures (and an awareness of the need for those pressures) if a concerted effort could be introduced. (Think of something like the strong legal structures that were once put into place to protect indigenous Amerinidians from alcohol, given their lack of genetic protections against alcoholism.)
High line is so cool
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